SP nerfed. We were lied to.

[Cairdeas]

lol people bitch about hating Surplus XP, then bitch about the balance issues they iron out in its abolishment. Can't ever win.

[Chocobits]

lol people bitch about hating Surplus XP, then bitch about the balance issues they iron out in its abolishment. Can't ever win.

I agree with this, to an extent. I think the lowered SP/kill should have been taken down in increments while the system is being updated to be more "party friendly", instead of all at once. Lower SP/kill by 50-150~ per patch until we have a working party invitation system that allows us to search and find players seeking, not suddenly earning 15-25% of what we used to.

Also, to not contradict earlier statements he's made about leves being solo friendly, leve mobs should give an SP/Kill that decreases with a larger number of party members. IE they give 400-600 per kill solo at the optimal range, 300-500 in a duo party, 200-400 in a trio, and so on and so forth.

And finally, in recent years FFXI has adjusted the amount of exp given to solo players fighting "Easy Prey" or "Decent Challenge" mobs (mobs less than 10-15~ levels below your current level) to cater more to casual soloers. A soloer can earn quite a decent amount of exp/hr in FFXI by focusing on mobs that are below the optimal level to form a party against.

One thing I would like to see in this thread: I'm seeing a lot of "Nu uh! We got xxx SP/Kill and XXXXX SP Bonus so you're doing it wrong!" I'm not seeing too many specifics: particular leves, level range, # of party members, completion time, or anything that would contribute to their alleged success. It's like, if you've found a system that works, don't share a crumb of helpful info and instead troll the rest of the community for their ignorance.

On the other camp, we have nerd raaaage and solemn oaths of abstaining from/quitting the game until they get their way.

So let's take something positive out of this:

Those of us that would actually like to form a grind party would all LOVE a proper search function so we can efficiently form up.
Those of us that are casual soloers would love to see a BIT more reward for our work. The MP costs make soloing slightly less efficient and therefore we should receive reasonable gains.
Those of us that use "MMO doesn't stand for SOLO" as our manta should hurl ourselves into traffic. Yoshi-P specifically said the game would be solo accessible.
Those of us who want to raaage and then ragequit should just do it and not talk about it. Stuff will get fixed eventually but not on OUR schedule.

All that said, this entire update was very large and encompassed a lot of aspects of the game that needed fixing. As a whole though it feels like it was lacking in global perspective; I personally don't feel due consideration was given to the players left to cope with an incomplete implementation of a new leveling system. We're stuck in a limbo where many of our old ways are no longer viable, but the new ways won't be viable for some time. The few ways that apparently do seem to work are the highly guarded secrets of tight-lipped but loose-tongued trolls.

*edit* And do rate up this post if you agree. It's the most enlightening and universally applicable post you've read in this and many other threads.

[Xmbei]

Those of us that use "MMO doesn't stand for SOLO" as our manta should hurl ourselves into traffic. Yoshi-P specifically said the game would be solo accessible.

hmmmm maybe people forgot what MMO means... Maybe we should have a reminder MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online "..."
not MASSIVELY SOLOPLAYER online "..." yes there should be some solo content and thats fine its great to have those times when you cant play with other's to go do something on your own, but this is a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online game so if you just want to play the game solo from start to finish... you are playing the wrong games. I for one like the idea that yes you can go out and solo sometimes as I already said, but why play an mmo solo ALL the time? So I reiterate MMO DOES NOT MEAN SOLO! it means there is a community to work with and come to a same end.

[Chocobits]

hmmmm maybe people forgot what MMO means... Maybe we should have a reminder MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online "..."
not MASSIVELY SOLOPLAYER online "..." yes there should be some solo content and thats fine its great to have those times when you cant play with other's to go do something on your own, but this is a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online game so if you just want to play the game solo from start to finish... you are playing the wrong games. I for one like the idea that yes you can go out and solo sometimes as I already said, but why play an mmo solo ALL the time? So I reiterate MMO DOES NOT MEAN SOLO! it means there is a community to work with and come to a same end.

It sounds more like, if a game where others can advance at their own pace and want to forgo community in favor of having a few select friends to chat with while solo grinding bothers you THAT much, you're playing the wrong game. See what I did there. Anyone can twist a statement or acronym to his or her own warped perspective and use that as troll food.

[Synfrag]

And finally, in recent years FFXI has adjusted the amount of exp given to solo players fighting "Easy Prey" or "Decent Challenge" mobs (mobs less than 10-15~ levels below your current level) to cater more to casual soloers. A soloer can earn quite a decent amount of exp/hr in FFXI by focusing on mobs that are below the optimal level to form a party against.

Let's put this in perspective. I am going to use my current PUG Rank vs. XI's level for this equation as a direct comparison. These are rough numbers that I am actually seeing right now. It is not intended as an exhaustive XP parse.

FFXI (Pre-XP Buff)
@L24 total XP required to reach 25 = 5,100
EP (Easy Prey) 27XP per mob (Avg between 20 and 30)
Requires 189 mobs to level up

FFXI (Post-XP Buff)
EP (Easy Prey) 60XP per mob (Avg between 50 and 70)
Requires 85 mobs to level up

FFXIV (Current)
@R24 SP required to reach 25 = 25,000
EP (Green Aldgoats) 150SP per mob (100 - 200)
Requires 167 mobs to rank up

So the direct grind element is similar to that of XI in it's earlier days however FFXI had no other source of XP back then either really. So this puts XIV somewhere in between the two when you count levequests. However, this is not including the Fields of Valor that was introduced to XI a couple years ago which greatly increased the rate at which XP could be soloed.

Keep in mind I didn't take into account anything related to speed of kills etc. And easy prey at lvl 24 in XI can often times kill you unless you know what you are doing and are decently geared.

Personally I did most of my XI leveling in the old days so to me, post nerf XIV is still fine. I got my PUG from 23-24 in about an hour with all the new quest content.

I have no clue about party XP which is where it seems most of the complaints are coming from.

[Charismatic]

I have no clue about party XP which is where it seems most of the complaints are coming from.

Actually, grinding parties in XIV right now are just fine. In fact, at this point in time they are THE VERY BEST way to gain SP. The problem is all the other methods of gaining SP are terrible in comparison now. They basically just turned the game on its head.

Would a duo work? Or is the only viable option a full group?

Duos actually don't seem too bad, did well enough earlier today with just me and an archer for a bit. The SP was certainly far better than the behest we had done only moments prior, didn't approach pre-patch numbers but it was only a duo.