"To Improve PvP game balance, the ability Cleric Stance will no longer be usable"

[Divinemight]

Math.
So 262 > 786?

I can see why there is a communication gap between you and others from this response. Not meaning to offend you, bur let me clarify.

I am using this parser only because it is not biased. This PvE Scholar is unaware of this discussion and simply is performing his usual routine. Rune 2 damage is filtered out. 80,476 is the raw damage from dots. His INT is 222. 1 INT = 1 spell damage = 362.50 (round to 362). His Dot dps is 124.58 from dots only.

Post 2.38, Scholar has 322 INT, the damage goes up to 120,350, dps 184.02.

2.35, most scholar equipped vit with 30 to MND (470 MND) . Cleric Stance swap int and MND, so 470 INT = 170, 375. Cleric stance gives 10% = 187,412., dps 286.

I have ignored rune 2 and sub stats. Also, if this is really PvP scenario, I can guarantee you no dps will have 100 % up time when healer start to sprint. Dots however is 100% up time.

Just from number SCH dots @ 286 vs BRD 262. At PvP, does bard able to do that dps with range potency penalty? I think not.

[Hollowed]

Willful Blindness

Where in the world did you just pull 286DPS out of that parse? You are telling me that SCH's DoTs are ticking for 858 (average) on ever tick not even factoring in Ruin II? You telling me that SCH is doing almost 20% of his HP? That SCH just went up to #3 on the DPS list...

Only thing I did was use your "example" and tell you why it was incorrect. and my numbers were per GCD not per second, meaning it was each attach not each second. Also you say only DoTs, but you have no idea what this SCH was doing. Did you see the heal parse? WHM was over double the heals of the SCH even with AoE that is still huge, what that means is this SCH was doing more than just poping DoTs and going back to healing. Please get your argument straight before you go on pretending you know what you are talking about. And I read over your post many times I still cannot figure out where you pulled 286DPS out of a parse that said 124.

You added to the SCHs dps to make it look better but you didn't factor any of your "math" for that BRD, the BRD stays right where it us but somehow the SCH jumps up over what twice his DPS was earlier? Perhaps I should make it clear that unless this SCH was a retard, he was using CS for his DPS. Stop trying to argue with numbers you do not understand, you cannot mix math with OPINION. Don't pull numbers out of your a$$, if you want to argue numbers go parse yourself and give the results, the only thing I did was use the numbers YOU posted.

I gave you math, you still argued, its very apparent you cannot take in reason. You are not a victim of unfair balance you just do not understanding how the game works and how each class is meant to be played.

I am very curious how you managed to figure the SCH was out DPSing the SMN; as I said don't pull numbers out of your a$$, parse yourself it will do all the math for you.

[Zyphione]

I reply for thought, please excuse.

Rune 2 damage is filtered out. 80,476 is the raw damage from dots. His INT is 222. 1 INT = 1 spell damage = 362.50 (round to 362). His Dot dps is 124.58 from dots only.

Post 2.38, Scholar has 322 INT, the damage goes up to 120,350, dps 184.02.

2.35, most scholar equipped vit with 30 to MND (470 MND) . Cleric Stance swap int and MND, so 470 INT = 170, 375. Cleric stance gives 10% = 187,412., dps 286.

I have ignored rune 2 and sub stats. Also, if this is really PvP scenario, I can guarantee you no dps will have 100 % up time when healer start to sprint. Dots however is 100% up time.

Just from number SCH dots @ 286 vs BRD 262. At PvP, does bard able to do that dps with range potency penalty? I think not.

You compare relative situation? I can understand calculation but I recently watch PVP video from JP player who do SCH PVP only and spend most of time defeating 2 or 3 people by self at Mael OP and Adder OP.
After watch video can safe to say underline is correct? Melee DPS stop when the SCH sprint.

I say problem for why stance is OP is because of way DOT is manage?
SCH is standard no-VIT SCH, meaning use MND item with 4000HP with food. That way crusade stance change MND and INT value, if I not mistaken it go from 400MND to 400INT? This stat same as SMN if sync down? I am unsure as crusade stance not usable any more. MND and INT on gear is same though and value swap is linear.

..but I do not understand post very well?
I know how to relate both the situation you are giving about T9 and PVP, I can try to see what you comparing - but do not understand if I see point completely.

Basically given number, SCH have sustain DPS comparable to SMN but higher than BRD, for Sprint and movement make it difficult for BRD to DPS?
I agree because staying in range very difficult for most and almost impossible depend on where you fight SCH, I have no test recently as stance remove but video show DOT damage for 480 or sometime 520 without エーテルバースト.
Is this what you trying to show?

From my understand of your post, I can make deduction SCH can not be stop because DOT is 100% doing damage? I know that the only way to stop SCH doing damage is to stun them. Not possible to slow down their damage or mitigate the damage they do because of how damage value is manage in the game and how is not difficult to manage SCH shield. Statistically then is possible for SCH to defeat 3 people by self with stance but not possible for SMN to do same thing.

Am I right to say this?
Or something I am not understanding?

all I did.. I was mistaken. I said I wasn't..I didn't disprove you because I don't want to, ..nothing to do with PvP and you cannot read correctly. ..I am not trying..

cannot even come up with your own..get pissed because I .. I admitted I don't want to talk about that anymore .. attack me. .. opinionated as every other person

Where in the world did you just pull 286DPS out of that parse? You are telling me that SCH's DoTs are ticking for 858 (average) on ever tick not even factoring in Ruin II? You telling me that SCH is doing almost 20% of his HP? That SCH just went up to #3 on the DPS list...

my numbers .. you have no idea what this SCH was doing. Did you see .. pretending you know .. I read over your post many times I still cannot figure out..

You added to the SCHs dps to make it look better but you didn't factor any of your "math" for that BRD, the BRD stays right where it us but somehow the SCH jumps up over what twice his DPS was earlier? Perhaps I should make it clear that unless this SCH was a retard, he was using CS for his DPS. Stop trying to argue with numbers you do not understand, you cannot mix math with OPINION. Don't pull numbers out of your a$$, if you want to argue numbers go parse yourself and give the results, the only thing I did was use the numbers YOU posted.

I .. its very apparent .. you just do not understanding..

I am very curious how you managed to figure the SCH was out DPSing the SMN

[Divinemight]

Where in the world did you just pull 286DPS out of that parse? You are telling me that SCH's DoTs are ticking for 858 (average) on ever tick not even factoring in Ruin II? You telling me that SCH is doing almost 20% of his HP? That SCH just went up to #3 on the DPS list...

Isn't that how Scholar heal? Scholar healing = Scholar + eos. Some parser will show eos healing and some will not. You can't read Japanese so I won't blame you. Eos healed at 343.91 on this parser. The total HPS for this scholar is 807.6. WHM is @ 887.53. Nope, it is fair to say that this Scholar is healing.

Only thing I did was use your "example" and tell you why it was incorrect. and my numbers were per GCD not per second, meaning it was each attach not each second. Also you say only DoTs, but you have no idea what this SCH was doing. Did you see the heal parse? WHM was over double the heals of the SCH even with AoE that is still huge, what that means is this SCH was doing more than just poping DoTs and going back to healing. Please get your argument straight before you go on pretending you know what you are talking about. And I read over your post many times I still cannot figure out where you pulled 286DPS out of a parse that said 124.

You are clearly still have no clue about where I am coming from. I made it clear that I have set up conditions before I analyze this data:

1. The actual HPS of this Scholar let me set the he is only doing dot as fixed variable.
2. The damage done is from dots only as fixed variable.

From above two fixed variables to obtain a number as set parameter to analyze how would cleric stance impacting the scholar's dot damage.

By taking gear setup of Scholar on the Frontline at 2.35 (vit accessories and mind attribute), the MNd should be 440 + 30 = 470.

The I am compare the two scenarios by using same Scholar. One scenario is this Scholar,s normal damage without cleric stance, as shown in the parser. The second scenario is this same Scholar used Cleric Stance. The INT and MND swapped, 80k dmg from 222 INT into 170,375 dmg from 470 INT. Cleric stance gives another 10 % = 187,412, more than 100 % increase by simply click one bottom.

The sub stats and rune 2 are irreverent because I already used that number as set parameter. I am doing the mathematic by comparing the amount difference before and after the Cleric Stance.

I will repeat it one more time. Whatever this scholar doing is irreverent, the set parameter has included everything.

You gain more than 100 % damage by simply using Cleric Stance to swap INT and MND with 10% damage.

I gave you math, you still argued, its very apparent you cannot take in reason. You are not a victim of unfair balance you just do not understanding how the game works and how each class is meant to be played.

I am very curious how you managed to figure the SCH was out DPSing the SMN; as I said don't pull numbers out of your a$$, parse yourself it will do all the math for you.

Lol, you given the math to compare based on GCD when Scholar dots are not even GCD regulated but damage per second instead. How does that even make sense? I am not going to use rude word like you, but please do check what you are comparing first.

In PvP scenario, SCH dps from dots is remain the same because dots are 100% up time. BLM and BRD are controlled by range potency penalty and interrupt per hit mechanic. All Meeles. won't have 100 % up time to output maximum dps because of the sprint. There is a translated Yoship interview after 2.35 on bluegrtr Fourm that admitted meeles are buffed because both mnk and drg's mechanic are designed based on target is stationary.

[RiceisNice]

To clear up the things with DoTs, their damage is calculated on time of cast. This is very evident with bard DoTs and their two crit buffs (straight shot and internal release); it has 20% bonus crit for the entire duration of the debuff, even when the buff fades from the players.

This would also be the case for cleric stance and SCH DoTs; It gets the full damage boost as long as they cast it while in cleric stance, and retains it when they swap out.

[Wise6]

SE should of not remove Cleric Stance.(at least for FL) it a 24v24v24 it all about how you party do not just you. yes a sch can go solo and a OP with Cleric Stance but only cause your pet can still heal full, if they just make it so you pet can only heal like a 100hp with in CS you gold. PS: 2 good dps can kill any healer in under 10sec(seen it happen lot). PVP is for hardcore putting your skills to the test.
whm and sch both good, sch more solo / whm are great when there 3+ of you medic 2,whm(X) that a lot of hp.

there a lot of other party setup you can use to help you win. trying a sch whm smnx6 you dots can kill like nuts.

[Hollowed]

scholar is 807.6

Well you are right I cannot read JP, I assumed it was combined as most people parse it that way.

If that parse was done with CS off then I will admit my mistake I just assume when a healer is going to DPS they use CS, if that is not the case however then yes I would end up with different numbers than you. So assume you are telling the truth (because I cannot read JP) I have to say...that is one bad ass SCH to be third on the DPS list.

I am not unreasonable, far from it, a SCH doing 15%+ of T9 HP I really still don't believe it, however, I am not fool enough to argue with numbers. But seriously if that SCH is out DPSing the SMN then something is really wrong with one of the two :X

I must admit though I did think you were willfully blind, however we would have both ended up at the same number had we both been on the same page, even if CS was being used you clearly understand how the math is done. That being said, out of all due respect I say: I am glad I had this conversation with you, and to that I am sorry for being snippy.

[Zyphione]

View

SCH dps not solely because of pet, pet heal usually not enough in most case as PVPer have improved and basically know how to damage now. This not like most MMO where balance is build around class synergy because this game have no class synergy in formula.

When build on individual balance, removal of stance is most logical when compare to reduce fairy healing.

FL can be party type of PVP zone but balance changes done by class and category.

[tehomegaking]

can someone please help me? my scholar is missing fester and my eos doesn't seem to have enkindle T_T

[Zyphione]

can someone please help me? my scholar is missing fester and my eos doesn't seem to have enkindle T_T