Can we just have the Wrath of the Lich King Raiding Scheme?

[ZohnoReecho]

Ah yes, the vertical progression dilemma. It is a problem many people have brought up before which can only be solved by stopping ilvl surge (or expanding level sync to ilvl sync, which would certainly make a lot of players wanting to see the effect of their high end gear unhappy). However, the issue here has more to do with finding a way to turn new players into raiders. As I've stated in a previous post, back in WoW's hey day, there would be people advertising for new static raid teams every other hour. That is because by the time people had reached end game they were very comfortable with working in teams and as such created an environment where people joined parties just to enjoy others company. Not only that, but this continued far beyond release as new waves of players complete the journey to end game. Fast forward about ten years later to ffxiv:arr: The chat logs are dead and party finder is dominated with "win" groups discouraging new players from doing the content.

Creating conditions to nurture and reward positive player-to-player interaction is the top priority of any MMORPG end game. On top of which, the ever rising ilvl means that previous content cannot be used as part of that ladder due to its increasing irrelevance to progression. The group must have a reason to form, reasons to socialize in order to build healthy working relationships, and then reasons to discuss strategy that involves possible alternatives.

My AK example was not about iLv but more about how much you can dumb down something. What is an easier fight? A fight where you don't die? Or don't die too much? Where the only big moves remove 20% of your HP at best?
Maybe a fight where you just have to memorize 2 or 3 boss moves and half of them can be ignored since the damage is so low?

Yoshida is growing the community too fast? The people here don't wanna spend time learning something and you say the game is too fast?
People are too tired to even chew what they eat before gobbling it. No wonder the gaming community is going down the drain.
People want things so quickly that the amount of stuff that gotta be produced gotta be a lot and of shitty quality as a consequence.

You want a more complex combat system? Imagine a complex combat system to control while people gotta move out of plumes! You wanna blow their minds? As if adding skillchains would make people win more fights…

This is a game that requires memorization, cooperation, coordination and even socialization.
If you wanna go on with the fights learn those things or there is Habbo out there.

[Fendred]

My AK example was not about iLv but more about how much you can dumb down something. What is an easier fight? A fight where you don't die? Or don't die too much? Where the only big moves remove 20% of your HP at best?
Maybe a fight where you just have to memorize 2 or 3 boss moves and half of them can be ignored since the damage is so low?

It's not an easy dungeon. It's just that people are doing the dungeon with an ilvl almost twice its requirement. Case and point, I thought they removed the flies from the wall encounter, but it turns out we're just killing it so fast they don't even spawn. Same thing happens with the glowy death balls on final boss. The boss dies so fast he doesn't even hit phase 3 to use it anymore. Therefore, it doesn't matter how interesting an encounter they make because the ilvl will rip it a new one the second ilvl hits critical mass.

On a side note, that wall encounter was supposed to teach new players to watch for cast bars, max their dps, and avoid falling to their death. How can the wall encounter accomplish that goal when new players can deck themselves out in ilvl90 equipment shortly after hitting the level cap? The vertical progression problem aids the destruction of the ladder needed to turn a new player into a competent raider, so people have difficulty dealing with the harder end game encounters. The only way to keep the ladder current in vertical progression is with multiple difficulty levels or two separate dungeons that cover the same kind of encounters in the current content.

[ZohnoReecho]

It's not an easy dungeon. It's just that people are doing the dungeon with an ilvl almost twice its requirement. Case and point, I thought they removed the flies from the wall encounter, but it turns out we're just killing it so fast they don't even spawn. Same thing happens with the glowy death balls on final boss. The boss dies so fast he doesn't even hit phase 3 to use it anymore. Therefore, it doesn't matter how interesting an encounter they make because the ilvl will rip it a new one the second ilvl hits critical mass.

By the way, that wall encounter was supposed to teach new players to watch for cast bars, max their dps, and avoid falling to their death. How can the wall encounter accomplish that goal when new players can deck themselves out in ilvl90 equipment shortly after hitting the level cap? The vertical progression problem aids the destruction of the ladder needed to turn a new player into a competent raider, so people have difficulty dealing with the harder end game encounters. The only way to keep the ladder current in vertical progression is with multiple difficulty levels or two separate dungeons that cover the same kind of encounters in the current content.

Then SE should just stop removing requirements to access fights (see leviathan) and making such a catch-up patch if, as you say, people should learn something before accessing stronger equip that give them access to harder fights.

Remove the dumb soldiery system and make it so people MUST face harder content lil by lil if they wanna progress equip and battlewise.
If instead of teaching people what to do they allow them to skip everything, what and when will they learn? It's like giving a motorbike to someone that never drived a 2wheels. What do you think will happen?

But no. People gotta rush to the top and then ask to crash down the first wall they meet.

People can see SCoB when the nerfs come out.

That is the terrible game design that should be avoided, not nerfing old content, but locking people from content until its outdated, an eternal "catch up" game that would be solved by tiered difficulty.

none is locking them out. they are doing everything themselves…