Why is FFXIV considered to be so hard/hardcore?

[Darki]

Just a question I have been struggling to understand since launch...

So many people consider Coil to be impossible to get a group for and incredibly difficult. People struggle on extreme primals for months... Etc.. Etc..

Personally I have never understood it, nor have I seen an MMO community with this kind of fear of the content.

I have played virtually ever major MMO, and most minors of note. I have seen a lot of communities and a lot of different kinds of content/dungeons/raiding. But never until this game have I seen the difficulty of the raids being discussed so often in guild or on the forums. People I came here from Rift with, people who beat pre-nerf Akilyos and Hamerknell (which were on a magnitude of difficulty a thousand times harder than anything in FFXIV. Think 10 times the mechanics and fail conditions, you even had to do platforming jumps and dodging without telegraphs in the fight!) tremble in fear of FFXIV.

Personally I don't understand... I look at this in comparison to that, and this content is a cakewalk. Even WoW LFR raids have content that I would consider more difficult than FFXIV. So what is it? What makes these raids so much more intimidating and hard than any other MMO that has been on the market? Why are so many people here unable to clear content, when they have always done so in the past?

Honestly...your not crazy lol. To answer your question, FFXIV: ARR is filled with a lot of casual and first time MMORPG players. Players from any of the games you mentioned would crush binding coil without breaking a sweat. Binding coil just isn't that hard compared to content from other games.

[Sarlazzar]

Once again, the raids are not hard, its getting the people that doesn't suck that's hard. also if you've played every major MMORPG, then you must have not played them properly and never really tried the actual end game hard content, cause you simply won't have the time to do that in every major mmorpg.

[Tsuwu]

This thread, to me, is silly.

People will complain about literally anything you can offer them.
There are people who want it to be impossible without 72 overgeared perfectly in-sync robo-neckbeards who grind 18 hours a day.
There are people who want it to be a fancy cutscene where you basically click "yes" to win, and get all your loot dropped immediately.
Neither side will ever see eye to eye with the other. And neither side will ever be happy.

It's hard because some people find it to be hard.
It's extremely casual because others find it to be so.

[Adelphe]

I agree this thread is stupid, every person is different, and what we find hard or challenging will differ to others, i have raided in WoW and the reason i found WoW raiding easier than FFXIV is mainly the latency, alot of people will say "i dont lag, must be just you" but being an EU player with a average internet connection, i find the telegraphs in FFXIV very unforgiving, u lag for a split second and your get hit, and to be honest i dont overly enjoy the bind coil of bahamut, i love ffxiv dungeons and CT raids, but i find the bind coil abit boring and depressing

[Aldora]

I prefer to think that every player has their own view on what is difficult and what’s not.

For me personally, i think that Coil is difficult to clear. But, i don’t mind that. It’s a challenge i want to overcome myself. I love Levi Extreme, because it’s a challenging fight and i’m having a blast doing it. Titan Extreme on the other hand, not so much. That battle is still like a thorn in my side. I have cleared it but a few times and the trail itself is very unforgiving.

For some reason, i have no problem memorizing the routine from the Levi Extreme Trail, but i just can’t get the Titan Extreme routine in my head. Maybe because i’m too anxious and don’t want to make the tiniest mistake, because it would either mean i’ll fly over the edge or get smashed by the Weight of Land.

Does that mean i suck? Well, maybe a few people would think i do. Do i think that i suck? No, not at all. I just don’t see myself as a top tier player, but as an average player who wishes to improve along the way and overcome the challenges ahead. Even if it will take me more than a year to do so.

There will always be people who are better than me. Who can clear content a lot faster then me. If you allow me to be the “Tortoise”, i’ll will make it to the finish. Someday. And i shall be proud of the accomplishments i’ve made.

That’s why i would ask everyone to respect your fellow players. Even if they are not of the same level as you yourself are. Some might have a more difficult time than others to clear their content and will view/perceive the difficulty differently than the people who’ve already cleared it, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they suck.

[Turin]

From my experience, there are a few things. I led a guild through several games where we achieved world and server firsts in raiding and PVP objectives.

1) The game is unforgiving. The encounters are so finely tuned to a full group, that one death is impossible to recover from. Not difficult, but everyone messes up.

2) Slower GCD makes skill choice and timing much more important.

3) The gimmick kills (BCoB turn 2) are extremely limited (I'm looking at those saying AoC was the best. Please. The bosses were constantly broken.).

There exists one major reason beyond these encounters. Time versus content available. In many games you log on, raid, log off. Maybe PVP. FFXIV has a lot of time-gated content available worth doing. Our core of 5 players just bought a large house. We're working on our Novus weapons, doing hunts, PVPing. We want to do SCoB but find the time investment necessary to not be optimal at this moment. It has nothing to do with intimidation or difficulty.

[Makado]

XI was much more challenging. If you wanted to down a big boss 6 or more people had to work together. In XIV 4 or more people just spam their solo abilities and follow the "script" and boom...done. The only skill it takes to dodge scripted and telegraphed attacks in XIV is the ability to point your eyes at your screen. If you can't do that, there's something wrong with you.

Yes because FFXI was so difficult. Stand in place, sleep adds, heal haste attack skill chain. Kraken club DRK 2 hour all boss. Lol.

[Xatsh]

XI's fights were not hard at all honestly. XI's difficulty was simply in progression as a whole. It took 20-30xs more work to get anywhere in that game. And it required 18+ ppl in most cases to get optimal progression. Yes you could get decked out enough in your guild where you stood still and ate things to the face. Or zerged down a boss in 20secs. But that took years of work to obtain in most cases 4-5+yrs of working as a guild to build up to.


XIV has fights. SE is attempting to gating content with difficulty and not time. Problem is once you beat it, since the fights are 100% scripted there is no longer any difficulty. There is nothing hard about. Move here and live 100% of the time => repeat until fight is won.

So what game is more hardcore. The game that will take years of hardwork, alliances, and planning/organization to get to the BIS gear. OR the game that utilizes a single party that is fighting a fight which is identical every time you go in but has 100% guarantees of 2 BIS pieces per win.

The answer will be what is hardcore. IS hardcore hard content? Is hardcore the willingness to put in the hardwork and time required to get BIS gear? Is it a combination of the 2? The generation you started playing mmos will define your answer. In the casual generation hardcore = hard content. casual = easy content. Midcore = semi difficult content. Oldschool it is going to be more of a factor of mindset and playtime.

[Tashigi]

Its not difficult, this is just a massive case of the "first MMO syndrome"

I laugh at every thread talking about how unforgiving crafting is when I still have nightmares about crafting in other MMO's

It's a combination of the above quote.
Mixed with the horrendously backward-coded server check points for movement/actions the game offers.

Basically, think medium/average challenging content with lag.

[Yukiko]

(..) but has 100% guarantees of 2 BIS pieces per win. (..)

I dont know about your static, but throwing away mnk gear because everyone already gotten theirs... sure, its 100% BiS, no one is playing mnk in our group... so yea, everyone equipped their secund class... but still 100% BiS ... ...