Who is gonna raid now with the iLvl 110 gear handed to people??

[MythToken]

Yeah if anything this will INCREASE the number of raiders, since their slight bump in gear from hunts acts as a handicap to their slightly lacking skill.

It certainly bridges the gap for smaller FCs who are almost beating T6+ but can't quite pull it off, and allows them to progress towards T9 where as otherwise they would be stuck behind a content wall.

I don't see how any of this ruins raiding, and in fact just makes it more accessible for a lot of talented players who might be stuck with a mediocre group.

[cryptic_angel]

Storyline, weapons, the simple fact that solidery gear isn't BiS.

Honestly the best gear is a combination of solidery and coil gear. Either one on it's own isn't the best.

Weapons and storyline are really only rewards for clearing t9, t6-t8 is pretty much worthless atm aside from BiS. BiS is really only a 5-10% dps boost.


Here you go raiders, the rewards for spend months progressing through SCoB, a 10% dps boost.

Yeah if anything this will INCREASE the number of raiders, since their slight bump in gear from hunts acts as a handicap to their slightly lacking skill.

It certainly bridges the gap for smaller FCs who are almost beating T6+ but can't quite pull it off, and allows them to progress towards T9 where as otherwise they would be stuck behind a content wall.

I don't see how any of this ruins raiding, and in fact just makes it more accessible for a lot of talented players who might be stuck with a mediocre group.

With the first BCoB, SE had to increase the ilvl of the allagan weapon because not enough ppl were doing raids when myth gear was available.

Having raiding quality gear available from what amounts to fate grinding takes away incentive to raid regardless if you guys want to admit it or not.

A different question might be: What's the point of i110 if you're not using it to do coil?
If the object of the game is to get i110 gear, then I suppose no one would raid any more. (Except that it's a faster way to get gear in some respects).
But isn't the object of the game, for many people, to beat the hard thing they haven't been able to beat yet?

Some of our groups need a bit more help from gear than the others.

Turn 6 and turn 7 are hardly gear checks, they are skill checks. You do not need anything close to ilvl 110 to down those turns because the mechanics are almost all awareness based crap that will wipe the raid.

There is really little point to raiding once you clear T9. Farming the same four bosses for months only to be 10% better than some player who only does hunts and ST. Seems like a shitty imbalance to me.

[Velox]

People do raid for the challenge. Everything isn't just about gear. I couldn't care less what weapon or gear I'm using, but nothing is more satisfying than taking down a difficult enemy. Being able to get BiS pieces is a nice bonus though, but because BiS isn't needed in FFXIV, it will forever be a bonus.

[Xystic]

Actually, the OP is right, it will cause people to start doing coil less, just like Myth gear did to First Coil.

This is false.

If you go look up vertical progression systems, one of the biggest problems with vertical progression systems was that a gap would form in the community and it would result in the collapse of both communities.

To solve this issue "Up to Par" gear has to be given out all the time in vertical progression systems, especially MMOs that plan to release content on a fast track such as this one.

Giving "Up to Par" gear has much more supported evidence that more people actually do or CAN do the current content.

Without such a system most of us and those just joining, we'd still be at EX Primals. Go look at the requirements for some of the top FCs recruiting atm. If it wasn't for "Up to Par" gear, we wouldn't be anywhere close to those requirements. Its easier to teach players to become good versus trying to fight RNG to regear players so they can do content. A good player can be taught in a couple days or weeks. Gear can take months to years to obtain in some MMOs depending on how many tiers or arcs there are. I don't think most top tier FCs are going to re gear individuals for years so they can continue forward.

[ispano]

People do raid for the challenge. Everything isn't just about gear. I couldn't care less what weapon or gear I'm using, but nothing is more satisfying than taking down a difficult enemy. Being able to get BiS pieces is a nice bonus though, but because BiS isn't needed in FFXIV, it will forever be a bonus.

People who raid for the challenge only do so on the first kill, not repeat kills. They're also the smaller group of raiders. Most simply do it for the rewards.

This is false.

If you go look up vertical progression systems, one of the biggest problems with vertical progression systems was that a gap would form in the community and it would result in the collapse of both communities.

To solve this issue "Up to Par" gear has to be given out all the time in vertical progression systems, especially MMOs that plan to release content on a fast track such as this one.

Giving "Up to Par" gear has much more supported evidence that more people actually do or CAN do the current content.

Without such a system most of us and those just joining, we'd still be at EX Primals. Go look at the requirements for some of the top FCs recruiting atm. If it wasn't for "Up to Par" gear, we wouldn't be anywhere close to those requirements. Its easier to teach players to become good versus trying to fight RNG to regear players so they can do content. A good player can be taught in a couple days or weeks. Gear can take months to years to obtain in some MMOs depending on how many tiers or arcs there are. I don't think most top tier FCs are going to re gear individuals for years so they can continue forward.

"Up to par" gear is what we had, i100. Practically the SAME is not what you're describing.

[bennettaj]

the way i see it, is the people who are hardcore raiders have most likely beaten t9 and have it on farm. so why are you crying? and this just gives newer players who may eventually be hardcore raiders a chance to get gear so that they can beat SCoB so they will be ready for the new coil in 2.4. you have to let some people get access to certain things in order for them to grow as a player so that they may become that hardcore raider. dont make all this nonsense and thus separate the community even more.

[DoctorPepper]

This is irrelevant, new coil/gear/incentive in the next patch. They did the same thing with the last set of patches, ST is meant to bridge the gap between casual and hardcore players so that they don't fall too far behind. Not everybody has time to raid, personally aside from the occasional pug group I have no time for a static in the Summer due to work travels so I do most of my raiding in the winter when I'm less busy.

[Nekodar]

Some people that manage to get i110 soldiery may not even be interested in raiding to begin with, and haven't bothered to progress beyond T5.
Some people may want their soldiery at i110 to be able to dye it.
Some people may want high allagan because it's BiS, or simply because it looks good.
Some people raid because of the challenge, others because of the loot.

Anyone that actually WANT to raid will continue to raid. Anyone that just wanted i110 gear period may decide it's not worth raiding...

[Risvertasashi]

-snip-

Well, to rephrase an earlier post of mine...

Why do you feel the need to incentivize it for the non raiding crowd?

Edit because I've apparently hit my daily limit:

The incentives are not for the non-raiding crowd. The incentives would be for the raiders to keep raiding after the initial clear. There is very very very very little incentive to raid at this point if you have a t9 weapon.

Well, here's where I disagree. BiS is important to me. It's important to a lot of high end players. You're only going to get about half BiS (give or take depending on your job) through soldiery gear.

And like someone else said, the high allagan stuff just looks way better.

[Exstal]

People do raid for the challenge. Everything isn't just about gear. I couldn't care less what weapon or gear I'm using, but nothing is more satisfying than taking down a difficult enemy. Being able to get BiS pieces is a nice bonus though, but because BiS isn't needed in FFXIV, it will forever be a bonus.

You forgot a key word, "some". I only raid for the gear, as does my group. After you beat it once, there is no more challenge since you've got it down after you've done it once. To say it's challenging after you've already beat it is folly.