I think it is time to admit the obvious - Echo is an insult to the average gamer.

[Darki]

what does this have to do with a Massively multiplayer online role-playing game?

The point I am making is that the OP obviously wants echo removed just because he wants it removed. OP isn't even considering the fact that there are others in this game who might want it to stay put nor does he even seem to care.

My personal opinion? I think because the game encourages you to try it in a fight once without it, I think it's ok just how it is.

It's an interesting way for SE to implement difficulty settings into an MMORPG like how many console games have "Easy, Normal, Hard" settings. After all, different players have more fun in different difficulty settings.

[Baneus]

As near as I can tell, the average FFXIV player is older than than most other MMO players and tends to not to have large amounts of static free time due to other things going on in their lives (that is to say, their free time tends to suffer from RNG). People like the OP are the exception rather than the rule and, fortunately, tend to gather in the same FCs. Which is like a cheat list for creating a blacklist for elitist douches.

[RakaMaimhov]

I agree let's take away echo from everything. Even class/job quests. Yes.

[Giantbane]

While I do agree that old content must be easier to clear and hence it is easier to farm right now gear that requires tomes of Mythology, Echo acts as an obstacle rather than an enhancement.

Why is the fact of getting easier gear not the same help as receiving Echo? It is simple.

• You still have to start from scratch and work your way through
• You still have to grind allot to obtain gear that requires tomes of Mythology
• You still have to learn boss fights
• You still have to be challenged
• You still need to understand the complexity of in-game mechanisms

Basically less grind (which in this case there is still significant grind) does not mean that the challenge is easier. It means that you still have to work and sweat but it will take less time to do so.

And how much different is that to Echo? Well let us look again at the bullet points. In short,

• Echo promotes the most flawed idea that removes the challenge from the game, the idea that dying has no consequence because you will get the buff required to pass it through regardless of your performance.
  
• Echo being your pillar where no matter what happens, it will guarantee you the easy way out, does not actually help the player. It only pushes players that are not ready for the next challenge, to be moved to more complex and more difficult challengers.
  
• Echo in a way, is like a PvP buff where the losing team is unable to fight back and is granted a "pity buff" instead of relying on its own powers and capabilities. For someone to have an in-game buff after dying, it means the system considers you as someone who is not capable to learn, adapt and improve and that is why is an insult.
  
  Echo in the big picture is not such a big deal, but it creates a type of culture that should expect to die and not be punished.

And that is exactly why Echo is counter-productive. It creates a system where players are not ready to progress further in the game because they have learned that it is "ok" to make a mistake because at the end of the day, Echo will help them pull through. If players do not learn to deal with situations accordingly, they will pass on the same problematic patterns or weaknesses to stronger parts of the game. It moves the problem to the next challenge and does not deal with it because the same players are bound to repeat the same mistakes if not more.

[B]Everyone is capable of getting things done with practice. Practice makes you better./B]

These are my thoughts as a new player.

It's not necessarily that *you* that needs the echo, it's also there for the rest of your group. The reason is that most of the real quality players have done these fights to death and have no interest in them any more.

It's not that there are *NO* good players still doing this stuff, but not nearly as many. So the echo makes up for the fact that your average group doing this old content is much more ... well ... average.

It also doesn't guarantee a win (see garuda x & titan x).

[Nicobo]

...These are my thoughts as a new player.

IMO ECHO buff works like let you have your "future gears" for current fight.
If someone say ECHO makes fights too easy,
I suggest they should try the fight with lower iLV gears(past gears) ^^

BTW, old content should be nerfed bcoz the loot has been nerfed passively,
old content doesn't worth the same difficulity as it was new.

[zulu_kulu]

SO OP is this your thing now? you are just gonna make a complaint thread everyday?

[Nabian]

I think many of you are missing the point entirely. It's funny at how many of you support the echo buff (I'd imagine most of you rely very heavily on it) yet most of the time everyone always reverts to Titan as their "go to" defense. Titan is a weird fight and one of the few fights where instant death mechanics make up majority of the fight. Titan aside most of the fights in this game rely on group awareness/cohesion, and mild DPS checks from time to time.

I know that this has been designed as a game for the masses (aka even a brain dead monkey can play this game) but that doesn't mean we should be spoon feeding bad players. As the OP stated, players need to learn how to handle and manage the mechanics. It's not about casual versus hardcore/elitist and I for one and sick of this argument. My GF who plays 1-2 hours week. She's NOT a gamer and only plays because it's something we can do together...and she agrees the game is too damn easy. I think the biggest problem is players don't want to work for things. They want it handed to them on a silver platter. I think that there should be content in the game that not everyone can clear. Its an MMO its supposed to be that way. Why is it so important for you to beat everything? If your not skilled enough or you don't have enough time to play the game then find a game more suited for your talents (something like hello kitty island adventure).

[Kerberon]

Wait the guy with the thread about how he keeps getting kicked after causing wipes wants the game harder? My brain hurts now.

[Kimikryo]

Is it ... rokien?

He also started a nag thread every day ... or more

[Kiyouma]

So you're telling me that you want to take away benefits that help those in need simply because you don't like it? Have you considered becoming a US Senator?