Considering hanging up my shield due to high level haters.....

[Ricky]

What happened to enjoying the game and learning the mechanics?

You are about 8 months behind to learn the mechanics for stuff you're on, I suppose we should let all new students teach themselves arithmetic too, teaching tools are not fun

[Aurelius]

No you're not the only one. You'll always find that one elitist bugger that likes to speedrun everything, do HM and EX primals with no wipes and generally dislikes anyone who doesn't preform to their expectations. The first time I did Titan HM the only help I had before doing it was my friend whom I was in a Skype call with and an image guide to Titan's rotations and bomb positioning. We did just fine, but the MT hated the fact that me and one other damage were new to the fight and tried to kick us after the first wipe.

You're the tank man, you have a lot of power in instances. If you don't want to speedrun then say you don't want to speedrun. If they kick you for that, laugh at them because you have near instant que time and can just join another dungeon and probably do three dungeons before they get a new tank XD Laugh at them more after you report them for abusing the vote-kick system.

Lol well said my friend!!

[Eye_Gore]

This doesn't make sense, you know that right? Yes, everyone was new once. But being new doesn't automatically mean you have to learn slow or not at all. Also, their attitude isn't condescending in the slightest.

con·de·scend·ing adjective \ˌkän-di-ˈsen-diŋ\: showing that you believe you are more intelligent or better than other people.

If that doesn't describe what I have witnessed in game or sometimes here I don't know what does, (not from everyone, but they are there) and I was talking about the person's reply that I replied to. They were very condescending on describing the example that they gave about game play. Every person is different we do not learn things all at the same rate, some pick up fast others slow, regardless of the teacher or what they are trying to teach themselves, its human nature.

[ispano]

con·de·scend·ing adjective \ˌkän-di-ˈsen-diŋ\: showing that you believe you are more intelligent or better than other people.

If that doesn't describe what I have witnessed in game or sometimes here I don't know what does, (not from everyone, but they are there) and I was talking about the person's reply that I replied to. They were very condescending on describing the example that they gave about game play. Every person is different we do not learn things all at the same rate, some pick up fast others slow, regardless of the teacher or what they are trying to teach themselves, its human nature.

Except in the case of the person you responded to, he was RIGHT. In fact I can tell his mindset is at least somewhat similar to mine. I feel all but a select few people have the ability to do what he described, those who can't aren't at fault because it's usually something like a physical or mental disability preventing them. And i'm sorry, you CAN teach yourself to learn better. I did it myself as a kid, and I know others who have as well. But it's something you have to be willing to do and then CHOOSE to do it. Most people don't. So, yes, everyone learns differently and at different rates, but they can also learn to be better than they are. If you think this is condescending, or anything related to it, you're wrong. It's closer to having faith in those people than what you're posting.

[Eye_Gore]

If you think this is condescending, or anything related to it, you're wrong. It's closer to having faith in those people than what you're posting.

Never mind, interpretation is left up to the reader. I just read it and interpreted it in a different way than you did. As in my post, you took it in a different way that I had intended it to mean, but again that's where we are all different.

[Pibz]

This threads...
Why are you people discussing this kind of stuff still?
Old fight, most people know it? You want to learn by yourself? Go with someone who wants to do the same.
Don't bother people who've learned some the fights almost 8 MONTHS ago with your "QQ but i want to learn it myself so i'm going to make you wipe 2 hours for it "(A lot of people would take more than 2 hours for figuring out fights on their own even) in the Duty Finder.
It's the same ridiculous attitude as someone who goes into Brayflox duty finder and demands that the whole group speedruns just because he wants to.

[Valthein]

This threads...
Why are you people discussing this kind of stuff still?
Old fight, most people know it? You want to learn by yourself? Go with someone who wants to do the same.
Don't bother people who've learned some the fights almost 8 MONTHS ago with your "QQ but i want to learn it myself so i'm going to make you wipe 2 hours for it "(A lot of people would take more than 2 hours for figuring out fights on their own even) in the Duty Finder.
It's the same ridiculous attitude as someone who goes into Brayflox duty finder and demands that the whole group speedruns just because he wants to.

That's the problem, your attitude towards the subject is why party finder was formed, Duty finder is actually for the people to LEARN. I would love to see where in squares or any other mmo companies terms it says YOU the player HAVE to watch EVERY youtube video of EVERY dungeon or raid BEFORE attempting otherwise this act will be harassment and deemed bannable. If you can show that to everyone or have a GM clarify that this is the case, then so be it, people who are complaining about new players or old players learning new jobs like tanking really need to stop as that is harassment! belittling, name calling, booting b/c they don't know something and all the other little things you do to get someone to leave a dungeon is guess what HARASSMENT! Now granted you get a guy in a lvl 30 dungeon wearing full lvl 8 to 15 vendor gear ya feel free to boot him, he/she knows better by that level and just wants to be carried and/or cause a hard time. BUT people who are learning, no one has a right to just boot or complain, don't like it leave and/or use the party finder.

[ispano]

Never mind, interpretation is left up to the reader. I just read it and interpreted it in a different way than you did. As in my post, you took it in a different way that I had intended it to mean, but again that's where we are all different.

Yes, that's something else you can teach yourself. To look at what's said, and to not immediately interpret it a certain way, but to analyze it and think about what they actually mean. When I reply to a post, I've read that post at least 3 times. The other thing you can teach yourself, is to read your own words and change them to avoid misinterpretation. You read it and think to yourself what someone else might think when they read it.

[Tiggy]

Duty finder is actually for the people to LEARN.

Please state where it says that anywhere?

Seems to me that you're assuming it's there for learning, but in actually it's there to help you find parties. You're the one putting the "learn" aspect to it.

It's a cultural thing too. Some American players use DF to learn, and they use PF to get wins. Japanese player's use PF to learn and DF to win going about it exactly the opposite of the American attitude. The Japanese players don't like wasting each others time so they go off to PF to learn it before subjecting random people to their inexperience. The fact that there is a cultural divide in the way the feature is used speaks volumes about how Duty Finder is not by default for learning.

TLDR: Party find is solely for FINDING PARTIES. Any expectations beyond that are yours and yours alone.

[Malakhim]

Except in the case of the person you responded to, he was RIGHT. In fact I can tell his mindset is at least somewhat similar to mine. I feel all but a select few people have the ability to do what he described, those who can't aren't at fault because it's usually something like a physical or mental disability preventing them. And i'm sorry, you CAN teach yourself to learn better. I did it myself as a kid, and I know others who have as well. But it's something you have to be willing to do and then CHOOSE to do it. Most people don't. So, yes, everyone learns differently and at different rates, but they can also learn to be better than they are. If you think this is condescending, or anything related to it, you're wrong. It's closer to having faith in those people than what you're posting.

I hate to say it, but I agree with this. Yes, we should be as inclusive as we possibly can, but if we're trying to get through something, at some point we WANT to get through it. People don't want to be banging their heads against the wall because they have a tank or player that refuses to communicate, listen to advice, and or be observant and try to up their game. My first English professor in my bachelor's said the following, and I feel that with a few changes in wording, it can easily be applied to this situation and more: "If you don't care enough to edit/improve your work, then why should your audience care about reading it?"

I'm not going to say this is the problem EVERY time, and really as I mentioned before, being new doesn't mean that they're a bad player, but this sense of entitlement from this type of player is just as damaging to the community as an elitist player who wants to tear down people for not shaving off .02 seconds off a dungeon run. It's a two-way street.

Additionally, saying that the Duty Finder is for any specific thing is a farce. The difference between the Duty Finder and the Party Finder is that the latter tends to have the objectives of a given group stated, whereas the Duty Finder requires players to communicate, compromise, and decide on how they're going to handle a given run. The Party Finder wasn't created to leave the DF as a learning experience. It was created because this community is terrible at communicating with each other unfortunately.