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  1. #1
    Player
    Wolfandre's Avatar
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    Wolfandre De'asura
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    Siren
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    Gladiator Lv 80
    Also, I see the writing of the summoning out as going through complex equations that vary each time you use them (different levels of aether in the environment can affect your summon, so parts of the equation need to be tweaked each time). The other spells, such as Bio, and Miasma, are used much more frequently and are likely much simpler equations that can be gone through in ones head or are just used so often that they wind up being committed to memory.

    It is interesting to note, however, that no where does it say in the ACN storyline (and do correct me if I am wrong) that personal aether wells are necessary to take advantage of arcanima. In fact, all an arcanist is doing when they cast their spells is taking ambient aether and routing it a specific way in order to obtain results. Maybe there is hope yet for those that cannot be thaumaturges or conjurers. This does beg the question of why MP is consumed when we cast spells, but that may just be a game mechanic to limit the player or a showing of mental effort put into each cast, rather than actual aether consumption.
    (1)

  2. #2
    Player
    TinyRedLeaf's Avatar
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    Character
    Lyland Battersea
    World
    Chocobo
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfandre View Post
    It is interesting to note, however, that no where does it say in the ACN storyline (and do correct me if I am wrong) that personal aether wells are necessary to take advantage of arcanima. In fact, all an arcanist is doing when they cast their spells is taking ambient aether and routing it a specific way in order to obtain results.
    Actually, that isn't fully correct. Murie, the Mealvaan Gate receptionist, explains that the aether does, in fact, come from within the arcanist.

    Quote Originally Posted by Murie
    Arcanima is the science of employing "arcane geometries" — intricate patterns that map the unlocked mysteries of existence — to draw forth and manipulate the body's aetheric energies.
    So, that would explain why the arcanist's MP is consumed when he casts spells.

    In that sense, you're partially right: Of the three magic-using classes in today's Eorzea, the arcanist is technically the one who is the most proficient in managing personal wells of aether. The thaumaturge, as seen in the class storyline, would have to rely heavily on alchemical means like ether potions to supplement his MP (in gameplay terms, though, a thaumaturge who properly manages his astral and umbral cycles wouldn't run out of aether so easily). As for the conjurer, she'd literally kill herself if she draws from her own aether instead of the elementals'.

    There's also the arcanist's aetherdam trait which, I imagine, comes from the use of arcanima to trap and store up a reserve of aether within the body. This then allows the arcanist to unleash the pent up aether in a sudden burst, for potentially devastating effects.

    I further imagine that it's this aether-managment ability that allows you, the player-character, to become a summoner. During the job quests to acquire the various egi, Y'mhitra specifically instructs you to focus on your personal aether, while you form the image of the primal in your mind's eye.

    Given the vast amounts of aether to summon a primal's true form, it wouldn't take a stretch to believe that a summoner would also have to channel a tremendous amount of personal energy, just to call upon a fraction of the primal's power.
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Darske's Avatar
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    Character
    Darske Aldrech
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 50
    About geometric patterns bringing forth life, there's actually a documented real-life example of something like this. Check out how mathematical fractals are actually everywhere in the biological world, it's pretty crazy.

    I see the Arcanist and, by extension, its Jobs as having magicks that utilize aether and a similar fractal principle. By inducing fractals or modifying them, the spells they weave create very specific kinds of life or phenomenon. These can either be harmful, like short-lived bacteria that eat away at the limbs of an enemy, or helpful like the Scholar's spells. Of particular interest here is that when casting a Scholar spell, the patterns around your grimoire actually look very fractal in design.

    The fact that both stem from the same class, Arcanist, implies that the two applications of horrifying consumption and soothing healing arts derive from a single equation. Perhaps then this is why we see the same pattern recurrant in the pages of the grimoires- the base, if you will, for the more complex equations it branches off into in the jobs
    (3)

  4. #4
    Player
    Wolfandre's Avatar
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    Wolfandre De'asura
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    Siren
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    Gladiator Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Urthdigger View Post
    Actually, it's mentioned in the blm and whm quests and lore that they are unique for using the aether of the land (hence the destruction wrought by the war of the magi.) So, by exclusion, we can see arcanists use their own aether.
    Yes, but I had said Thaumaturge and Conjurer, not Black Mage and White Mage. Granted, conjurers don't traditionally use personal aether, but it is shown that it is possible through the conjurer quest line.

    Quote Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
    snip with a quote from the receptionist
    That is actually a bit out of context, given the subject of arcanist spells. Arcanists use their spells to manipulate the aether in their targets bodies to enfeeble and enhance.

    However, given how vague her wording is, one could argue that she meant it either way. *shrug*
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player
    Urthdigger's Avatar
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    Eyriwaen Zirhmusyn
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfandre View Post
    Yes, but I had said Thaumaturge and Conjurer, not Black Mage and White Mage. Granted, conjurers don't traditionally use personal aether, but it is shown that it is possible through the conjurer quest
    My comment was unrelated to conjurer/thaumaturge. Rather, it was stated that blm/whm are forbidden because they draw aether from the land, and caused an umbral era by their overuse. Given that those two jobs are noteworthy for that, I find it likely that all other classes use personal aether for most of their power.
    (1)

  6. #6
    Player
    Wadoka's Avatar
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    Dec 2013
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    Ul'dah
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    Character
    Eilis Tozet
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 52
    Quote Originally Posted by Urthdigger View Post
    Given that those two jobs are noteworthy for that, I find it likely that all other classes use personal aether for most of their power.
    Tricky, that.

    Though we've seen from the example of Sylphie and Sylphie's mother, that's certainly possible, we've also seen that even a gifted magus doesn't battery enough "personal" Aether to sustain their life processes through extended drawing on their own stored reserves.

    Now given, people who can learn the Way of the Arcanist learn Aetherflow, which allows them to store more Aether in their selves (the mouseover for an active Aetherflow reads "Aether is gathering in the body") It's doubtful even a Heroic Arcanist (us) could long survive without extremely careful husbanding of their Aether.

    I see the end result of an Arcanist running out of MP, being, a dead Arcanist, sooner or later.

    But to offer a counter, I believe Arcanima to be an art of Subtlety as I mentioned above. Arcanist effects are not, for the most part, loud and showy. Through diligent study and careful refinement of formulae, the Arcanist has learned to generate maximum effect from minimum inputs.

    Imagine, it doesn't take a lot of Aether to start a corruption or corrosion process... all things strive towards maximum disorder already. It only takes the right lever in the right place, to paraphrase Aristotle. Now, going the other way? Curing, Resurrection? That's a walk on the wild side, to fight against Entropy, to convince it to look elsewhere for a bit...
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player
    Wolfandre's Avatar
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    Wolfandre De'asura
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    Siren
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    Gladiator Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Urthdigger View Post
    My comment was unrelated to conjurer/thaumaturge. Rather, it was stated that blm/whm are forbidden because they draw aether from the land, and caused an umbral era by their overuse. Given that those two jobs are noteworthy for that, I find it likely that all other classes use personal aether for most of their power.
    You cannot assign traits to one class based on the specific details given about a completely different job. That would be like saying that all cats meow and since all other animals don't meow, then they must be dogs.

    I won't, however, fight the base line of your argument, since we aren't explicitly told where, exactly, arcanists draw their power from.
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player
    Urthdigger's Avatar
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    Eyriwaen Zirhmusyn
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfandre View Post
    You cannot assign traits to one class based on the specific details given about a completely different job. That would be like saying that all cats meow and since all other animals don't meow, then they must be dogs.

    I won't, however, fight the base line of your argument, since we aren't explicitly told where, exactly, arcanists draw their power from.
    A closer example to what I said would be "Meowing is a defining trait of cats. One can thus assume other animals do not meow." Which is a logical assumption.
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player
    gornotck's Avatar
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    Character
    Bunni Stormjaeger
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 100
    Like many assumptions, it's wrong, though.
    Forgot, though, that the ink in arcanists' books is made of blood, though. Blood and precious metals.
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