Ul'dah or Limsa Lominsa - most dangerous city state?

[Alice_89th]

I agree with most people that Ul'dah is the more dangerous place.
Sure, Limsa isn't all sunshine and rainbows either, but it seems like there is less political corruption.


Personally I wonder where Ishgard ranks in this.
As long as you keep to Halone her teachings you should be fine, ... but don't and you'll be put on trial. And currently they seem to be considering even looking in the wong direction herecy. Doesn't help that whether you are innocent or not, being put on trial is certain death either way. People in Coerthas are walking on a fine line at the moment.

I have no idea what is going on behind those closed gates, but I doubt things are going well inside the city.

[Enkidoh]

Ishgard is a zealous theocracy based around the worship of Halone the Fury - even in 1.0 speaking to the Ishgardian soldiers on duty outside the Gates of Judgement, and they basically responded with "Who do you worship? And I pray to the Fury for your sake that you answer wisely." There is concept art in the artbook that came with the Collector's Edition showing apparent life within Ishgard, and it just looks like what you'd expect a large compact stone citadel to look like inside - lots of fancy stonework and narrow, steep laneways everywhere.

Really, it's not so much the worship of Halone that they're zealous about and more suspicion of dealings with the dragons that they're worried about - with suspected Dravanian sympathizers executed by being thrown into a canyon. Although on the surface this would appear a typical zealous 'evil church state', after visiting the cells in Whitebrim where numerous Dravanian sympathizers are held, it's obvious that this is a very real threat - more so those 'sympathizers' seem to in fact be tempered - they display all the classic signs of tempering (zealous ramblings towards a beast tribe/Primal, lack of free will), so there is definitely reason in Ishgard's madness.

Really Ishgard's only main fault is their stubbornness - during both the Calamity and Operation Archon Ishgard remained stubbornly silent and refused to commit a single soldier to the Alliance, resulting in the other three city states treating the Holy See with contempt. No doubt future patches will develop this idea as access to Ishgard is finally opened up.

[Alice_89th]

I agree that the threat that Ishgard faces is very real, the Stone Vigil is proof of that.

But I have also been wondering about whether the 'sympathizers' are really tempered or not.
Yes they seem to be, and for all I know they are, but during one of the quests the ever drunk jailkeep mentions that those brought here on suspicion of being a heretic usually deny everything in the beginning, but that they squeak differently after the inquisitors are done with them. I can't find the original dialogue, but your journal says this in the quest text:

Ferdillaix grouses about the din caused by Boyle. It does seem inconvenient that in exposing a man's heresy, the inquisitors also make him loud and more than a little mad. However, no good can come of humoring unbelievers or criticizing the inquisitors...

Which I interpreted as: they torture the suspects into confessing.

With the situation outside of the city literally being a frozen hell, I am really curious about the situation inside the city. In terms of street violence it is probably the safest place to be, but their rather extreme worship gives birth to other types of danger. That, and a city/state/nation that withdraws itself from the outside world usually isn't a good sign.

But who knows, for all we know life inside the city walls might actually be pretty comfortable.

[Mahri]

Neither city is one you want to walk alone at night (unless you're a heavily-armed nutcase like we are). But, in daily life, it's a bit different in each.

In Ul'dah, there's some solidarity among the poor, to where things are relatively stable even if you're just barely scraping by. If you keep a low profile and swallow your pride, chances are you'll survive, and every now and then you may catch a break. However, the more you have, the more you have to lose. The rich of Ul'dah know this well, and they're more than willing to use this against one another. It isn't hard to find real-world examples of places like this one all throughout history, up to the present. Humanity is pretty resilient.

Lominsa is different. They have something like self-sustaining anarchy with an "establishment" that's respected, feared, and willing to throw its weight around. If anything gets out of hand, it doesn't stay that way for long. But, those unwilling to play by the rules of a society where crime is outright romanticized stand no chance (could you imagine if an Ishgardian tried to settle there!?) You have to know the culture, and you need to have friends, or it'll end badly. As real-world comparisons go, imagine a place run entirely by inner-city street gangs. The heated rivalries are cooled by bluntly-enforced unity, but there's still that pervasive sense that every single person is just holding back their own violent impulses.

Gridania...has its own problems. Its less about being a dangerous place to live and more about being an impenetrable theocracy where policy is dictated by forces that are quite literally invisible. It is not a welcoming place, and though it is empowered by its unique symbiosis with Eorzea's natural forces, it's population is low for a reason.

It's easy to see why a Garlean might look at the major powers of Eorzea and be just a bit horrified.

[Catapult]

Yeah, sorry but I'm throwing my hat into the Gridania ring.

In Limsa or Ul'dah, you piss the powers that be off, they might try and send a hit man after you or, worst case scenario, declare war.

But in Gridania, if you piss off the Elementals, they'll send the whole freaking forest itself after you. Good luck with that.

[Magis]

To add to everyone on Gridania, they are horrifying in itself. I recall a quest in South Shroud where a man is left to die because "if the elements choose to let him live, he lives". If IIRC they didn't and he begged for medicine to which you go get. The quest text also mentions they do this with children and babies too. Sounds like a cold place.

[Wadoka]

Neither city is one you want to walk alone at night (unless you're a heavily-armed nutcase like we are).

Yea, though I walk through the Valley of the Shadow of Death, I shall fear no Evil... because I'm the meanest son of a bitch in the Valley!

[Lucke]

How come we aren't victimized or attacked in LL or UD. As far as I know, you have no allegiance to a ship captain in LL, so attacking you for funsies won't antagonize your crew because....well, you don't have one. In UD's story, it seems like you're more on the Royalist side than the Monetarist side. So that might make you a target for the Syndicate. Especially later when they see how powerful you are. Being a powerful ally to the SUltana make throw a wrench in any revolutionary plans the Syndicate may or may not be planning.

I'd like to think that it's our affinity towards the Grand Companies that protects us. I'm a Lieutenant in the Flames, attacking me would prolly antagonize the Flames to attack the Syndicate (or whoever ordered the hit). Same with the other GCs visiting UD. If someone bad targets you and you are in the Maelstrom/Adders, they risk going to war with them as per the Eorzean Alliance rule thingy. So basically, I guess our affiliation with a GC protects us in LL or UD (without it, I think we'd be targeted because we are "too powerful")

Then what about Grid? The elementals don't care if they antagonize the Flames or Maelstrom. You can't really attack the elementals short of deforesting the Shroud. If the gangs wanna attack you or whatever shady elements Grid has, again, they run the risk of antagonizing the GC you are in.

So, I think our saving grace is the Grand Companies. We aren't targetted because the attacker fears retaliation from the GC.

[gornotck]

[...]

It's more our affinity for killing everyone who crosses our path when it comes to the Syndicate.
For Limsa Lominsa, I'd guess it's the fact that we're adventurers. We'll do anything that's asked of us. Technically, we have to, as adventurers. So there's little to be gained, for them, in making enemies of us.
Gridania's "shady elements" are along the lines of the Coeurlclaws, and the Redbellies. They don't care if you're in a GC.
I can't even really think of any real involvement with the Grand Companies that would explain, ultimately, any idea that they would prevent or retaliate against attackers of 'mere adventurers'.

[Catapult]

Oh, yes, YOU'LL be safe. Heck, you've got Hydaelyn herself backing you up.

But some pleb? Nope.