Honestly, let SE make as much money as they can.

[Ikeda]

I'm not even sure what you're talking about anymore.

You really can't say I'm OK with retainers but No to cash shop because Retainers and Phantasia honestly, are cash shop items.

If you are OK with Retainers and Phantasia then it supports my original point a couple of pages back that it all lies in its implementation and to dispell the fearmongering of cash shop = doom and gloom.

I'm ok with retainers because as someone who played FFXI for years I'm used to having to pay extra for more storage (I don't plan on buying a retainer either way). I'm ok with Phantasia because it's literally just a paid character recreation/race change service that have been in P2P mmos since pretty much the beginning just with the difference of it being a in-game item you use to trigger it. All that other crap I'm not ok with were never part of mmos until F2P mmos came around and a few P2P companies got big headed and thought they could get away with that on top of charging a subscription. As I've said numerous times it has been proven over the past few years that the very large majority of P2P mmos that have attempted that have failed for it.

[KiraVaela]

OP, you have to understand that if cash flow decline, it's very likely because people are not enjoying this game anymore and leave. The team working behind the game should work in such manner things don't go this way in the first place.

We pay them because we like what they are doing for us. This is how it should work. Not the other way around. We should not give them more money to keep them getting paid so they can keep the illusion of everything being ok while in reality it's not.

[Starkiller]

OK so what's the difference between paying extra for a Collectors Edition or paying a little extra each month for an additional Retainer? They are both optional "upgrades" to your FFXIV experience. The exclusive CE items do not make or break the game; they are nice little perks to have, but totally optional.

When purchasing a CE of the game you pay quite a bit extra up front for those optional perks. If you choose to add another Retainer to your account, you pay a little extra each month (for as long as you like). Again you don't have to have these extra retainers, they are totally optional and do not make or break the game.

So what's the difference here? I don't really see one and therefore it does not appear to be a big deal.

[Zwipe]

If retainers cost and extra $.01 cent a month, would people still fuss?

Of course they will, they are already paying $15.00. Why should they pay $15.01? They are being taken advantage of. They can get more storage space in another game for $14.99.

Nope, they are not cheap. They are smart. ;p

[Lord_Zlatan]

SE have been making half assed games since ... well FFX, excluding ARR

FFXII was not half assed, nor was XI. Ill give you Xiii-whatever.

[Lord_Zlatan]

If retainers cost and extra $.01 cent a month, would people still fuss?

Of course they will, they are already paying $15.00. Why should they pay $15.01? They are being taken advantage of. They can get more storage space in another game for $14.99.

Nope, they are not cheap. They are smart. ;p

no, they are being miserly (if its only .01 were talking about here).

Honestly, what do you people hold onto that you have a full inventory, armoire, and 2 retainers?

[Amberion]

I dont see retainer service as cash shop, but if we see it from your and other ppl point of view then fantasia is also cash shop. So if you say no to retainer then it will be a no to Fantasia too, they both share the same boat

@Razzle: got post cap yesterday so have to end the discusstion in weird way....sorry

edit: fantasia is a compare so dont jump the gun

Yes, I'm against that potion. Also against name changing. Some decisions should be permanent in the game.

[Zwipe]

no, they are being miserly (if its only .01 were talking about here).

Honestly, what do you people hold onto that you have a full inventory, armoire, and 2 retainers?

That's what i've been trying to say. If retainers only cost $.01 a month no one would flinch, which proves they WOULD buy it from a cash shop.

But because cost $2.00 a month, They're rallying up with picket signs.

So if you are willing to pay it for an extra retainer $.01 cent a month, but not for $2.00 a month...it shows they're being cheap.

[Yshnal]

If retainers cost and extra $.01 cent a month, would people still fuss?

Of course they will, they are already paying $15.00. Why should they pay $15.01? They are being taken advantage of. They can get more storage space in another game for $14.99.

Nope, they are not cheap. They are smart. ;p

That would make even more obvious that either they don't know how to manage their cash flow, or they're simply trying to take advantage of their subscriber base asking them to pay for something that can be paid with the profits that they get from the subs (and that they lie when they say that they want happy players/customers). Not to mention that doing it the right way (that's it, not making us pay a sub on top of a sub when it shouldn't be needed) would benefit everyone, so I don't really understand why some people are so stubborn defending them. It's not that hard to grasp, really, and we've said a thousand times already that the issue is with why (the whole context), not how much (2$ is nothing).

If you really want to gift them some money then, by all means, go and buy 50 copies of the game and leave everyone else to play a proper P2P game without cash shop crap.

[Ikeda]

That's what i've been trying to say. If retainers only cost $.01 a month no one would flinch, which proves they WOULD buy it from a cash shop.

But because cost $2.00 a month, They're rallying up with picket signs.

So if you are willing to pay it for an extra retainer $.01 cent a month, but not for $2.00 a month...it shows they're being cheap.

I don't really care about whether there's retainers or not but I've got to ask. Who's more cheap? The people that want a P2P game to stick to a proper P2P business model? Or the people who want "SE to make as much money as they can" but refuse to give SE donations they could easily give them without getting something in return?