Hardcore MMORPG's would be a massive failure if it was released in today's MMORPG era

[darkstarpoet1]

That's fair but why is what you prefer more valued than what I prefer then? If two people say it feels like work and one person enjoys it that's totally fair for them to have an opinion but if they're out-voted why are the people that don't enjoy it suddenly less valued?

nobody said they needed to be more valued. the truth is there are tons of mmo's that give the instant gratification that follow the questing structure. that is almost every game that's released now. when was the last game in which there was a grind with tons of open world content that was completed and released? i'd say probably xi or eve.

this game started that way and was rushed to release and was nowhere near ready. the problem was, unlike xi, they scrapped the bad release and went the safe route instead of fixing and finishing the game. that's where a bunch of older players with xiv have an issue. this game started off as one type of game, but turned and went in a completely different direction. it was advertised as one type of game and got the original box sales and the game today does not resemble the game they purchased at all anymore.

this game in it's current state compared to original release is like seeing a movie trailer for a new massive stephen king horror movie. you get so excited to see the movie and preorder your tickets. you go and watch the movie and you enjoy it very much. you enjoy it so much you cannot wait to get your hands on it to add to your movie collection when it releases. you pre-order the movie because you enjoyed it so much and couldn't wait to get your hands on it.

the movie comes out and you go pick it up soon as the store opens, get it home, put it in the dvd player, turn it on, and find out the horror movie has become a comedy. sure you may like parts of the comedy, but you wanted what you went to see at the theater and couldn't wait to get your hands on when it released. then you look around and realize all movies that are being released are comedies and they have completely quit making horror movies completely. you ask what happened to the horror movie you went to see at the theater and you had ordered to get on release day and you are told "well if you don't like comedies you can always go find something else even though they are only making comedies now"

[Blissa]

I love the game but I still say that the game needs more then 24/7 dungeon grind. They need to make crafting and gathering more rewarding then its current state. Also they need to add NM's to the open world. The only time I see people doing anything in the open world is to fate grind and if its a blue moon I may see someone gathering. As I said before and I will say again, this game isn't going to make it long term on dungeon grind alone. Just wait and see how many people leave this game for ESO!

[BlueMage]

The OP has made several of this exact thread. Check her history.

How many times does the same person need to remake the same thread?

And jeez, two pages of creating threads that are nearly identical?

[alexhatesmil]

this game in it's current state compared to original release is like seeing a movie trailer for a new massive stephen king horror movie. you get so excited to see the movie and preorder your tickets. you go and watch the movie and you enjoy it very much. you enjoy it so much you cannot wait to get your hands on it to add to your movie collection when it releases. you pre-order the movie because you enjoyed it so much and couldn't wait to get your hands on it.

the movie comes out and you go pick it up soon as the store opens, get it home, put it in the dvd player, turn it on, and find out the horror movie has become a comedy. sure you may like parts of the comedy, but you wanted what you went to see at the theater and couldn't wait to get your hands on when it released. then you look around and realize all movies that are being released are comedies and they have completely quit making horror movies completely. you ask what happened to the horror movie you went to see at the theater and you had ordered to get on release day and you are told "well if you don't like comedies you can always go find something else even though they are only making comedies now"

Not really. Let's rework your movie analogy to make it a bit more applicable to FFXIV.

A horror movie flops at the box office. In order to recoup their expenses, the producers decide to recut the movie as a comedy and rerelease it in theaters. They are entirely forthcoming with this information, and all of the new promotional materials brand the recut as a comedy. Everybody in the world should now know that the new version is a comedy.

You loved the original, so you go see the new version. Then you walk out and say, "WHAT?! IT'S A COMEDY NOW?!"

By the way, did I mention that because you bought a ticket to the original movie, the producers let you into the new one for free?

[Elvin]

Then I would even go as far ass remove the MMO from that. Any game that has its main focus on instances can't be called a MMO.

MMO = A lot of players.
Instance = Few players playing Co-OP.

+1

Apple woud call them iMOG! Instanced Multiplayer Online Game!

[KupoNuts]

The days of walking to your destination across treacherous terrain, or forging out into the open world to explore and see sights and face challenges others may never see seem like things of a bygone era now...it's sad really.

Things like this make me sad too. People come up with arguments "well people have jobs now"...well guess what, in the early days of WoW and FF XI people had jobs too, and they loved it.

[CrAZYVIC]

.

Yeah that is the reason for the FFXI have over a decade running, because the horizontal progression sucks.

You think for success in a MMRPG is neccesary 20 millions of users right?

Aion, Lord of rings, Swtor, TERA, Rift, now are "Free to play model", for Copy and paste the WoW vertical progression, yeah the "Casual mmrpg" is the way to go!

Who do you think, keep alive TERA, Rift, Aion and FFXI?. The hardcore "Fans", people keep consuming the product, they buy vanity items, pay montly fees, for help survive their game. "The casuals are now playing Call of duty or BF4 k?

No matter what do you. The casuals will LEAVE your game, because they do not care your efforts, the next month they will quit even if you release 3 raids, 3 dungeons, 3 primals battle. This kind of public Never stick with a game.

The people are here complaining, moaning and asking for horizontal progression, are the fans will be paying Yoshi-P's salary the next 5 years and these are the public must be PLEASED, not the casuals.

Do not confuse the "Casuals" vs the dedicated players. If you have everyday gaming sessions of 3 - 4 hours. You're not a casual, you are a dedicated player.

Casuals are the people who log in 1 - 3 times per week with small gaming sessions.

The OP has made several of this exact thread. Check her history.

How many times does the same person need to remake the same thread?

And jeez, two pages of creating threads that are nearly identical?

The OP intention is clear. Start Flame wars between Casuals vs Hardcore players, is a good way for troll indirectly, like.

Ps4 vs Xbox one
Pc vs ps4 ARR graphics
PLD vs WAR

etc.

[Autymnfyres]

His claim is not as far-fetched actually. There have been a few MMOs that have been released that tried to hark back to the days of old which either failed miserably due to Developers running into issues (example: Vanguard) ....

--------------------------------------------------

Vanguard didn't do well because of its bugs and difficulty in running on LOWER pc rigs. The game play was amazing and I and many others loved it!

You know all those people from other generations who can't spend as much time on right now? We're still here, even though we are not currently min/maxers, and I HIGHLY DOUBT we are the ones (*no matter how busy our adult lives are) who jump on for the super casual 18 minute chat room-I-can't-be-bothered-to-focus-my-attention-players. Prove it with stats and data from some valid university research and I'll believe it.

And for those players that are only interested in something super quick and non-long-term-goal-oriented, there are a multitude of "games" for your mobile phones and tablets. Perhaps that audience segment/player has somehow 'bled' into the MMO market???

I don't pay a sub on those sorts of twenty-minute time killing puzzle games; they are for marking time at the doctors office or in line somewhere, not for my dedicated entertainment value which I enjoy in the comfort of my media room playing on a rig I fund on a regular basis in order to obtain an awesome MMO experience.

Theres nothing wrong with a more casual game; its the hype/pr/advertisments about it that are clearly untrue which lure in some until the obvious becomes apparent. No amount of justifying or glossing over about how 'new' FFXIV ARR is will retain players either. That old adage about action being more important than words is relative here. I sincerely hope for those that are quitting and plan to 'check back' with the first expansion etc that they find the FFXIV ARR gameworld dramatically changed. Many will not be.

Its ok, several other mmo's worth taking the risk of checking out are on the IMMEDIATE horizon and a couple clearly have long-term players as their preferred target market too. *Nods and grins.

[zaviermhigo]

How is horizontal progression for hardcore players? FFXI was a timesink, but horizontal progression doesn't have to be. Think about this game, this game's vertical progression is really quick, you can just as easily keep the ilvl the same, and add more content that is quick and easy to do that is that ilvl. Its just variety we want, not particularly hardcore vs casual. VARIETY. Its bad for no one. Gear sets that actually enhanced abilities instead of just boring stats, is that too complicated, I don't think so. Just variety of content, variety of gear, variety period.


They already kind of have the style for it, like how CT drops gear, Ultima drops jewelry, but that's the only thing at ilvl 80, but imagine if there were 3 or 4 different types of content per ilvl, 24 man raids, 8 man raids and some dropped gear instead of just tomes. This is all I'm saying.

Make something 24 man pre made group that takes some coordination for fcs, that drops gear. Give us some reason to have an FC besides, better coil statics, and a house. At least give us hints.

[Doo]

The OP has made several of this exact thread. Check her history.

Maybe shes trying to convince herself rather than others.