"If you die twice, you're out"

[alhandra]

i see no problem with this at all. sure, there is probably the occasional baddie out there that makes a PT like this hoping for a carry but im sure most are just looking to scare away inexperienced or incompetent players. i put countless hours into learning Titan x, when i join a group labeled "farm" i expect to do just that. and i expect the people i join with to have put at least as much effort as i have learning the fight or be good enough that they can adapt quickly and learn from their mistakes.

some of the fights in this game are extremely unforgiving, the slightest mistake from one person, can end in a wipe and reset. is it really that out of line to expect people who join an "experienced" party to actually be experienced? and if you arent, are we not justified in holding you accountable for wasting the groups time and booting you?

i dont think the people making these groups are "elitist" assholes. they just want to play with folks that put in the same amount of effort as they did. its the people that think they are special snowflakes and that some how the rules dont apply to them or that the rest of the group should just deal with their ineptitude that are ruining this game.

put in the effort, learn the fight, and stop wasting peoples time

[Gandora]

We have two options that enable PF to distinguish between groups: new players welcome/let's learn the fight together and experienced players only/high level gear/you cause multiple wipes = boot.

I'd still say you have the complex since you do not realize there are actually two options yet choose to focus on one.

This give a valuable reason to show animosity toward each others, is that what you imply? What you call complex I call patience.

I have oodles of time. Please stop directing your comments at me. I am the one who joins DF Titan HM, DF primal extremes, hydra/chim, etc groups to help others. SOME people, however, actually have a more hectic real life than me and can only play so long every night. You should take their feelings into consideration.

I quoted you partialy because of the "We don't want to waste time." part, don't think i'm targeting you personaly but more the people doing it.

Yeah 5 months must've given you quite a bit of experience. *roll eyes* Much of the heroic content in WoW was pretty challenging. I never saw this rampant elitism in WoW in LFD or even in LFR. The elitism was saved for PVP, of course.

I find it funny that you think 11 required skill.

I started both at the same time (or nearly) and was more attracted to XI due to its system, which involve more skills then WoW & definately more than XIV.

Why don't you create PF 24/7 (let's say Titan XM) to give the noobs a chance to kill it ?

I did it for Garuda X, i'll do it for titan X without any problem because anyone have to start somewhere.

You see the problem with people like you is that they label someone else as "noob" & would rather unconsciously disrespect them for the sake of misplaced self pride. But hey guess what, flash news! In that load of people you below are players that could outparse you easily or outdo you on tank/healer once they feel comfortable with the fight.

But i'll give you two the credit, I guess i'm the one in the wrong, because I never look down at other players and I am rather willing to help them & make new friends. I'm obviously complexed.

[lololink]

You see the problem with people like you is that they label someone else as "noob" & would rather unconsciously disrespect them for the sake of misplaced self pride. But hey guess what, flash news! In that load of people you below are players that could outparse you easily or outdo you on tank/healer once they feel comfortable with the fight.

But i'll give you two the credit, I guess i'm the one in the wrong, because I never look down at other players and I am rather willing to help them & make new friends. I'm obviously complexed.

So the people that form a group asking for experienced people are disrespectful to the ones that are not experienced ?

It's the complete opposite, it's the unexperienced players that are being disrespectful by joining party and making other people wipe because they are lazy and don't want to create or join a training party and wants to be carried.

[scarletfoxxy]

It depends on if there party leader wants a kill group, a progression group or a farm group. I go for farm groups so in order to have a legit farming group, everyone must have the fight mastered all the way through. Most people don't get a chance to master the fight the whole way through because the lack of pugs, FC's or friends that can do it. So it works both ways. If you know you might die more then once then you should search for a progression group. If you now you can't go the whole fight without dying at all then you should avoid farming groups. If you know you haven't beaten the boss before or prone to dying then avoid the kill groups. Progression groups are what should appear 90% of the time beczuse 90% of the community seems to still be learning and THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. What;'s wrong is people's inability to admit they're still learning by fear of not getting in a good group.

[Gandora]

these players are screwing things up for other people and we should be nice to them ?

Oh please get out of your bubble, I saw so many said "experienced" players screw things up on a level of stupidity you could never imagine. Funnily enough they were preaching like you and they had that kind of "One fail = kick" behavior.

So what now? Shall we push the limit of human stupidity with more half assed PF status for these "wannabehardcoreOMGelitists"?

And to answer your question: Yes you should be nice to them, simply because you've been in their position before and you were once the burden of 7 other players.

What;'s wrong is people's inability to admit they're still learning by fear of not getting in a good group.

I totaly agree with you, but thanks to our lovely and friendly community.

[Ryuko]

This amuses me in Party Finder. I'd love it if the person starting the party died twice, and followed their own rules and left the party.

I've only heard of a party leader doing this once. As in, after he died the appropriate amount of times, he apologized to the group and left -- following his own rules. I was impressed when I heard this story.

Anyway, I generally don't join groups with a "die x times and you are kicked" comment... not because I mess up a lot (because I don't), but because I haven't really ever seen a group with that comment be successful. A lot of the time (not always), the party leader is either really bad at NOT dying, or they are a mediocre player despite being able to dodge.

[alhandra]

bottom line is, if you dont like the parameters the pt leader sets in the PF then dont join that party.

[Rex]

You just ignore these parties and make your own. That's all.

[Traek]

bottom line is, if you dont like the parameters the pt leader sets in the PF then dont join that party.

^
Why is this so hard for people? Who cares? Don't join and make your own parties.

As much as people are trying to paint the 3 strikes groups as elitist, I join them all the time, and I find most all of them to involve kind people just looking to get something done they have done many a times, and are capable of doing. An overwhelming majority of the time, the person who actually gets to 3 strikes knows they are having an issue, whether it be internet connection or other, and they themselves leave gracefully knowing what they joined and not wanting to hold 7 other people back. I have seen leaders leave because of their own rule under the same circumstances, and never have I seen one stay through 3 strikes, or try to be carried.

I have never been kicked from a party. My worse case was an Ifrit EX on a Monday where I was literally getting 2 second freeze lag as a DD, and therefore not being able to get out of plumes and dieing (couldn't run ahead like Titan EX or I'd kill the group). This wasn't even a three strikes group, but on the third time I apologized and said it'd be my last go (group was very competent) since I was unable to fix my issue. We actually ended up beating it even though I died 4-5 times, and I got pretty carried by those awesome healers. I since have not died once to Ifrit EX eruptions if it means anything, but really, have the decency to bow out if you are in over your head. I have 8 primal weapons, I am not there to "relearn" the fight and wipe for hours. I'll do that for my friends and FC learning groups, but not my farming/clear groups.

*edit* Also who cares if people think you are bad and /blist you? People need to stop getting so butt hurt over nothing. I'm sure those Ifrit EX guys thought I was terrible, even though I can do that fight with my eyes closed on a normal day. Stuff/internet/bad days happen, just recognize it and don't expect to be carried. I actually would have rather left that group then got the win through them, because I literally got carried when I know I pull my own weight.

[Xakery]

I think i speak on behalf of all players when i say, instead of an apology, we would be more grateful if you didn't shout things like that anymore.

I second this. It is very elitist and discouraging. I blame all the people who came over from other MMO's. 1.0 we had elitist but they were a small population on any server. Now everyone thinks they are entitled to everything and set elitist party finder comments and have dick rules.