People abandoning after 2 tries.

[Xayoc]

It's always someone else's fault isn't it.

Anyways waiting 2 attempts is way too long to vote abandon, I mean who has time to wait for two attempts.

Statement: It is when a BLM parses south of 100 DPS, a Healer gets knocked off every attempt, or a tank doesn't grab adds.

[Nysneirdre]

It's always someone else's fault isn't it.

Anyways waiting 2 attempts is way too long to vote abandon, I mean who has time to wait for two attempts.

Hey if you are the type who think you can destroy the wall by bashing your head against it, by all means stay the whole duration. Maybe that next headbutt on the wall will give you that victory.

[AjoraOak]

The better/more experienced a player is the more easily they can identify mistakes and see how serious they are to their chances of winning. Don't expect people to endure your/others mistakes more than 3 times unless the fight is going reasonably well (past 50% at least). DF is already a negative place because people tend to use it for learning since they don't have the same level of pressure as someone joining a server based group.

[Lemuria]

There are far too many intolerant players in this game, and it's starting to hurt it. There are plenty of people who are still learning the mechanics of particular fights and haven't had first-hand experience despite that they've watched a video of the strategy. The mentality now is that you have to have cleared any given content at least a dozen times before anyone will even consider you for a spot, which excludes anyone who hasn't already run that content and players levelling a new class or role for the spot.

Honestly, if that's the game you people enjoy then enjoy watching FFXIV become a distant memory with a skeleton crew of players still clinging onto it. I've seen many MMO's go down this same route, and ultimately they fail not because of the content, but because of the community.

[Valenten]

You are exactly right Lemuria. The funny thing is that the game honestly hasnt even been out that long for everyone to be all elitist and shit like they are currently.

[Nysneirdre]

It has nothing to do with that Lemuria. Its about the bad players who refuse to get better. I have no problem with a new players who is willing to try their best and learn. Its the people who go afk during CT, the people during Titan who don't bother to dodge stuff, the people during dungeon runs who just sit in reticles and eat it, etc.

Casuals have cried and whined and pretty much have killed the MMO genre over the last 10 years. They have dumbed down these games to the bone to appease the baddies.

I don't have time to group. Ok we will make 95% of the game soloable with silly stupid fetch quests. We will make it so you can level super fast.
I don't have time to make friends. Ok we will but in a group finder and slim it down to 4 man group instanced dungeons.
I don't have the new tech to play the game. Ok we will make the game run on the 8 year old toaster PS3.
This end game content is too hard! Ok we will nerf it so you can clear it.
The overworld is to dangerous! Ok we will make it where most of the mobs don't agro, thin out of population, shrink the world size, and put in a ton of teleport spots. We will also only have mobs chase you 10 steps before giving up.

[Anapingofness]

Casuals have cried and whined and pretty much have killed the MMO genre over the last 10 years. They have dumbed down these games to the bone to appease the baddies.

Casuals didn't ruin anything over the last 10 years.

As for the rest of that stuff, are you seriously blaming casuals for that?

[Nysneirdre]

Casuals didn't ruin anything over the last 10 years.

As for the rest of that stuff, are you seriously blaming casuals for that?

Take a step back and look at the whole design of the game in general and others that have released in the last couple years.

Look at how you generate your character....the very few options to select.
Look at how they design the zones. The size of zones, the layout of mobs, the way quest hubs are designed. Look at how they design a vast majority of quests.
Look at how simplified classes are.
Look at the map they put in the game along with quest markers. They lead you right to the spot by the nose. There is no thinking involved.
Most of the game is soloable until end game.
They don't even teach you how to work in a group together until late in the game with mechanics that finally scale up in difficulty. They don't prepare you for it.

The game pretty much leads you around by the nose or with a rope around your neck until end game. Then you start a silly daily dungeon token loop grind to gear up.

They do this now because of the casual people who claim they don't have the time, the willpower, or even the drive to earn anything.
Why do you think free to play / cash shops do so well? Because casuals for the most part would rather buy their way instead of earning it.

[Terius]

anip

Fatal error. You're claiming casual = lazy. Casual players love the game, they just don't play 6 hours a night when they get home from work. I'm a casual player with a hardcore mindset, casual is time based and not interest based. I work full time and play games when I have free time. This does not mean I am any less 'into' a game or don't bother learning because I think others should pull me through.

Please can we all stop using the word 'casual' when clearly we mean 'bad player.'

[Nysneirdre]

Fatal error. You're claiming casual = lazy. Casual players love the game, they just don't play 6 hours a night when they get home from work. I'm a casual player with a hardcore mindset, casual is time based and not interest based. I work full time and play games when I have free time. This does not mean I am any less 'into' a game or don't bother learning because I think others should pull me through.

Please can we all stop using the word 'casual' when clearly we mean 'bad player.'

That's where you are wrong. The whole design of the game is to cater to casual players that don't want a difficult experience. Hence the dumbed down aspect of modern MMOs. Casual is not just about time constraints or bad players. Its about making things less difficult, less challenging, streamlined, faster, etc.

If you consider yourself a hardcore casual that's fine but you are more of a rare type of player. IF they catered to your type, the game would be more difficult right out the front door instead of late game.