To all of you complaining about content nerfs, I got an important question for you:

[Royin]

People seem to be concerned a lot more with the reward, rather than the journey.

Even though I feel the journey is important, I think it's unfair to demand other players to grind the same content over and over again in the exact same fashion as they would do it the first time. We're already putting so much time into this game, why not shave off 10 minutes?

[Licus]

A good test (in most subjects) do not rely on pure memorization. They require their students to actually think about how they are going to use the knowledge they've acquired in the specific tasks handed in the test.

I can't think of any good analogy to describe what's going on here with boss encounters, since it is a two-step challenge: 1. Figuring out the mechanics. 2. Execution

IQ tests for instance are all about figuring out the mechanics. Ice skating is all about execution.

I can see by your gear that you do not raid regularly on this toon, if at all. So, unless you raid extensively on some other alt, I don't think you are entitled to make such contrast and comparisons. Lets assume you raid on your lancer/dragoon.

Watching most kill videos only makes you aware of mechanics. For example, if you watch a video about Turn 2 ADS, there is no guarantee that the group you go into turn two with will kill the same exact nodes. You are over simplifying the opposing position to your supposed point of view. Watching a video to see a mechanic and wiping to see a mechanic are not entirely different. I am not sure how raiding goes for you, but our team never uses premade strats, we do what ever works the best for us.

Knowing before hand what the boss will do is akin to studying before a test. You go in with information, not a guaranteed win. By the way, figuring out mechanics is the easy part of the two step process you mention. If you walk into titan HM with no prior information to the fight, how hard is it to stay out of landslides and plumes? Not very hard, unless you are bad and/or laggy.

It would seem to me people have a much more difficult time executing the fight than learning that plumes and landslides happen in titan HM.

If watching a video is akin to cheating, I have no problem wearing that title. I can be a decent gamer, clearing all the game content while it is current and save time. You might find it fun to go into a fight blind and piss away time, but I rather get crap done and go do something else with my time.

I would like to add my own input to this:

People seem to be concerned a lot more with the reward, rather than the journey. I can't even get into a Coil group to learn the whole of Turn 1 from start to finish, mostly because as soon as a select group of people have the shortcut, everyone rallies behind them for easy-peasy loot. This is the exact same argument I had with XI: the content is already losing its value not because of Square Enix's actions, but because the community is so quick to give into their greed, their desire for that shiny piece of endgame pixel, that they ignore the fact that other people are doing Coil for the first time and may not value said "ezmodez" that highly.

Heck, Coil isn't the ONLY offender of this crime.

-CM/Prae? Anyone else who's done it will kindly go "skip plz, I need mah tomes and I need em naos, go watch CS later in inn room". Some people LIKE the immersion; if I wanted to simply watch the story without playing the whole dungeon through, I'd go watch a Youtube video.
-Primals/Ultima? Some people like the challenge, some people have enough time to try the fight after more than one or two wipes. Yet the minute anyone wipes, you guys tend to start a tantrum, whining because "such and such player suxorz, get Allagan gearz and get on mah level", when DPS may or may not be the issue here.

The one thing I CAN agree on though, is that there's not really any clear path to progression. That's half SE's fault, half the community's fault. SE hasn't really done enough of a job locking certain people out of content they aren't ready for (in addition to not scaling it properly); meanwhile, the community's insistence that you rush your Relic/DL set/CT set/etc. makes for one hell of a shitty endgame. Sure, the gear you get at 50 for your Job is great, but has anyone actually tried to use the common greens for 50s?

Y'all cry about wanting a challenge and then take the path of least resistance to power - all for what? So you can "lord" over players and tell them how to play the game (or even play it for them)?

You hypocrites make me sick.

You sort of make a moot point here. Rewards are always a strong motivating factor in real life, why would that not translate to a game? Maybe some players don't enjoy the journey and only enjoy gaining power. You enjoying the journey is just as valid as another player enjoying the reward. The statement you present is very narrow minded.

The problem with players like you is that you have some expectations of people to slow down for others. That is a very selfish point of view. When I use DF with random players, I don't expect them to rush on my behalf. I think most reasonable end game raiders share that PoV. None of us queue for Ct thinking it will be fast and smooth run. Most of us are actually surprised when CT goes smoothly and fast. If you group up with random people, you should expect random results. If you join my raid via party finder, you better come prepared and be ready to move fast.

You should not join random groups or pugs with the mind frame that your way is the right way and that's how content should be done. If you want to raid blindly and take your sweet time, form your own coil group.

And please, if a kill video makes things so "easy peasy." why do soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo many guilds get stuck on T5. Guess a video of the right short cut has not been released yet ^_^

[Richiealvian]

Things I've cleared: Everything
Things I've consulted youtube to beat: Turn 4 and Twintania. You don't see me complaining..
You'd think I lied for beating all the EX and T1/2 without consulting any guide, but I'd rather go in blind and enjoy my fun and let other people get the spoilers. Actually, i did lie. I did read a LITTLE bit on T2.

[Lumiin]

Haven't done coil yet. But everything else I've done so far I never watched or read anything. The game is too easy, just dodge.

[Emtron]

Did you got your relic weapon, beat CT and beat all Coil turns without ever consulting a website or youtube?

Did you learn all mechanics through your own analysis based on what you saw on your screen inside the game?

Back in the days, using outside sources such as the website gamefaqs to beat single player games or find out "secrets" was analogous to cheating.

Wikis and other websites "DUMB DOWN" current content by already handing you the answers to which the first groups were forced to learn on their own. If you are against SquareEnix dumbing down the old content, you better not be a hypocrite by dumbing down the content by using websites to get information you didn't manage to find out on your own through the game itself.

You sir are my hero.

[Emtron]

stuff

Honestly to your point studying the mechanics of a boss via watching videos or any other way still is no substitute for experiencing it first hand. I would say that people may have trouble executing fights simply because they may be afraid of screwing up because if god forbid you die in a a instance or a primal fight you may come across as the weakest link and be seen a the catalyst for why some people may rage quit or hide behind the enmity of the internet by pointing out YOU FAILED YOU SUCK LISTEN TO ME NEWB!! etc.. Alot of the fights in this game are not difficult it just that there is segment of this game that can intimidate the hell outta you because they just refuse to have patience with others because quite frankly they don't have to. I mean who likes getting chewed out by a 3ft tall Lala or a cat girl or boy when a game turns into something that stress's you out that's a bad thing. *long winded rant over* lol

[Licus]

snip

I don't agree with your first point. It's all relative to be honest with you. Some people get nervous when they don't know the ability set of a boss while others get nervous about performing a fight with experienced players. Again, it all falls to expectations. I don't expect anything from random pugs or DF groups. I rather play with like minded individuals and not look down on people for playing how they want.

At the end of the day, is it really that different to waste thirty minutes on learning first hand or spending 15 minutes looking stuff on the web. Lets be honest, if you are good enough to down twin, you are smart enough to learn the mechanics first hand. Videos just save time.

Lets use dynamis xarcabard from ff11 as a good example. You could have wasted weeks back in the CoP expansion trying to figure out which pulls to do, where to run, what mobs you had to kill to extend the timers or you could look at map on Google and start progressing towards dynamis lord. I don't know about you, but I would have rather made my way to dynamis lord than wasting time and gil while select people in the entire dynamis group learn what to pull and how to pull it.

Lets face it, video games are the greatest waste of time ever. Anything you ever accomplish in an MMO or a single player game will be forgotten and left to rot eventually. If I am going to be raiding, I am going to be doing it efficiently.

[ImDingDing]

lol, no
If you haven't watch a video you don't even have a chance to try these content, people kick you right away.
Try to tell every group DF or PUG, you are new and haven't watched a video and you won't even borther to because you can want to learn all mechanics through your own analysis based on what you saw on your screen inside the game then come back and tell us how is that looks like. lmao.

[Calvnor]

Do you play football without learning the plays with your team? Do soldiers go onto the battlefield to execute a mission without a briefing and every single soldier knowing the entire plan? The answer is no. This idea is ONLY acceptable when playing solo, NOT when others are relying on you to do your part. If you go into a very complicated and challenging endgame raid with other people and you didn't study the tactics of the battle, you are going to do nothing but hinder the other players' experience. Team games are not about your selfish needs to feel more accomplished, they're about working together. This entire post does nothing but explain your selfish nature and ignorance to MMOs in general.

[Axidrain]

thread would make sense if this was a single player game