So apparently FFXIV-App is banworthy now?

[Hitome]

Screenshots were meant to be saved and viewed with photo editing software, this would clearly fall under "authorized third-party applications". The unwritten list of "authorized third-party applications" is subject to change at any time, for any reason, with or without notice. Parsers have not been explicitly allowed, and people are getting in trouble for mentioning them for some internal reason or another. It's pretty safe to say they're on the "unauthorized" list.

Battle logs were meant to be saved and viewed so that people could put numbers to actions. It is why the battle tab is there by default.

Can you point the location to me, in the ToS, where it sanctions certain programs to view images that were taken in-game? I'm pretty sure you can't.

This whole debate is worthless and there are fallacies everywhere. The only thing you should be discussing is a lack of responses from SE. Has anyone even tried to contact a GM in-game to ask them a question about parsers? It would be much faster than waiting for a response on the forums.

On the other hand: you don't want to use a GM's response in-game. It's not very official. Just like one GM warning an account based on this where this has been the only case that has ever popped up where somewhere was warned for using FFXIVApp.

That's right: warned. Not banned. Warned.

Let's try again:

Warned. Not banned.

Do you know what most MMO companies do to people they find that are using 3rd party software? Ban them. Know what SE did in XI when people used third party software? Depends: was it Windower? Nothing. Was it a speed/teleport hack or bot? Ban. Know what SE did to people when they exploited a certain mechanic in a certain expansion without using third party software? Banned them.

[KaiKatzchen]

I don't think the issue in this thread is if the player was or was not banned from the game. It is obvious to anyone who reads the image that the GM said he would be issuing a warning to the players account and that any further violation would result in suspension of their login. So the facts based off the image (GM Covo) come down to this:

-Yes, the player was given a warning (Not banned or suspended)
but
-Yes, according to this GM it is an act that could end in suspension from the game for 72 hours
and
-Yes, will place someones account under review for permanent termination.
-According to the GM Parsing is against the ToS and a serious violation

These are facts that we can physically see and can not be questioned as anything but...

The issue that this thread is about, and the answer that SE needs to give is: Yes or No, can these parser things be used in conjunction with the game, or is the GM correct and they are 100% against ToS. Because we have the image, 100% proof of what the GM said...these are facts at the moment. I haven't seen proof of anything else that has been said or claimed in this thread.

[KaiKatzchen]

Still wondering what the answer is to this.

[MurakumoMillennium]

You also have tons who got banned for it, too.

Nobody ever in the history of any video game ever has ever been banned for using a VPN ever. Blizzard doesn't care if you use VPNs. What they do care about is that gold sellers also use them and that can lead to your account being associated with them, leading to a ban. But that's because the person in question was a gold seller, not because they used a VPN.

[blowfin]

Still wondering what the answer is to this.

I doubt we'll get one. They're about as likely to say it's forbidden, and act on it, as they were to say that Windower was forbidden in XI (this never happened). There are just too many people using it, and the backlash would be a disaster for SE's bottom line. It basically boils down to this, you can use whatever 3rd party tool at your own risk, as long as they don't directly interact with the game. FFXIV-APP fits this bill, as do VPN utilities. The major rule with using FFXIV-APP if you don't want problems: don't talk about FFXIV-APP, and don't ream out random DPS in inconsequential battles.

[Allyra]

Nobody ever in the history of any video game ever has ever been banned for using a VPN ever. Blizzard doesn't care if you use VPNs. What they do care about is that gold sellers also use them and that can lead to your account being associated with them, leading to a ban. But that's because the person in question was a gold seller, not because they used a VPN.

whatisthisIdon'teven.

People get banned because VPNs do automatic flags to their accounts for goldselling. It's an automated system Blizz has. If you think everyone who uses a vpn is a goldseller I don't know what to tell you. Many who use a vpn that have nothing to do with rmt get flagged in that game.

And AGAIN, it doesn't matter. This has nothing to do with this thread. The point is, people should not just assume because SE ok'd VPNs that means they ok'd parsers.

Use at your own risk as Blowfin said, don't expect them to be the same. That's the only relevance VPNs have to this thread, so you should stop trying to derail the real issue here.

[KaiKatzchen]

I doubt we'll get one. They're about as likely to say it's forbidden, and act on it, as they were to say that Windower was forbidden in XI (this never happened). There are just too many people using it, and the backlash would be a disaster for SE's bottom line. It basically boils down to this, you can use whatever 3rd party tool at your own risk, as long as they don't directly interact with the game. FFXIV-APP fits this bill, as do VPN utilities. The major rule with using FFXIV-APP if you don't want problems: don't talk about FFXIV-APP, and don't ream out random DPS in inconsequential battles.

Very true, I doubt SE would say they are forbidden, which makes me wonder even more how they would ever flat out say they were allowed in the first place... It would be smart for SE just to say 'look all 3rd party are against ToS, period unless we specifically say' and then put out some kinda list of sites etc they support 100% and players will NOT get in trouble for using. I just feel like this situation leaves players in the dark, seeing some claim SE said it was ok, yet players are specifically getting warnings (and who knows if someone has or has not gotten banned) about using it.

My opinion: Despite what players said SE said, a GM follows very specific rules that SE gives them. I'd go the safe route and not use one... then again I don't so the players that do will have to make that decision for themselves. I, personally, would never want to loose my progression and character for something so silly. And we know SE could do it, look at the backlash they got for taking away players gil who said they had earned it honestly, yet I didn't see a big drop off of people leaving due to that... SE could very well terminate people's accounts for this. Yes some will leave, and others will just start over.

[xopher]

Still no dev response. Usually they're pretty good about this.

[Seidaku]

I doubt they will ever come right out and say they support it. They would have to buy it then or pay royalties to its use and accept responsibility for it. So it will forever be in that grey area.

I do think that they will view it as a form of potential harassment however. So it will be up to the players to use proper judgement. You cant kick players for viewing cutscenes, cant vote kick for loot, cant harass people in chat, cant kick someone based on their dps. Kind of sucks but if you use it for a progressive purpose to improve I think they will turn the other cheek.

[Aicasia]

cant kick someone based on their dps.

Wrong. There is no rule against this. It is not harassment, nor can you effectively argue it is hurting their gaming experience because the exact same thing can be used as a counter-point. I went over this earlier in the thread I think, but the only reason you would not be able to kick someone for their DPS and still be within your right to do so without breaking the rules is if you insult or harass them for it before/after you've kicked them.