Anyone not so excited for 2.2 and the future of this game?

[Susanoh]

This game was looking like it was going to be much different from other games on the market in 1.0. A game with a gigantic open world to be explored, where you could main a crafting, gathering or combat job, each playing an important role in the world and interacting with each other. It wasn't all implemented well and felt for the most part unfinished, like a template for an interesting game that should have never been released in the state it was in.

Instead of trying to flesh out their original concepts, it seems like they instead put together a team to try to mold this game into what every other game on the market is. Quick, easy leveling, menial quests, handing out gear like candy, every important piece of content becomes instanced and the main world is basically a hub for people to queue up for those instances. Like it or not, it's what we have for now.

[synaesthetic]

*words*

How long is it going to take you people to realize that what you want is not profitable for a mass-market triple-A publisher and you're going to have to play a niche Kickstarter sandbox MMO to get it? (Camelot Unchained should offer what you're looking for, btw).

The average age of the MMO player has gone up and very few of us have the time to dedicate four hours or more to maybe get something done. I have a life outside of MMOs. I used to play FFXI before Abyssea, when Promathia was the newest expansion. You literally had to have at least four or five hours planned out ahead of time to sit down and play non-stop to actually make any progress. Those kind of games just don't resonate with people in their late twenties and early thirties who have jobs, lives outside of gaming and other things to do.

These games aren't intended or designed for people who need to play 8-12 hours a day. They just aren't.

[Susanoh]

How long is it going to take you people to realize that what you want is not profitable for a mass-market triple-A publisher and you're going to have to play a niche Kickstarter sandbox MMO to get it? (Camelot Unchained should offer what you're looking for, btw).

The average age of the MMO player has gone up and very few of us have the time to dedicate four hours or more to maybe get something done. I have a life outside of MMOs. I used to play FFXI before Abyssea, when Promathia was the newest expansion. You literally had to have at least four or five hours planned out ahead of time to sit down and play non-stop to actually make any progress. Those kind of games just don't resonate with people in their late twenties and early thirties who have jobs, lives outside of gaming and other things to do.

These games aren't intended or designed for people who need to play 8-12 hours a day. They just aren't.

I'm not sure what it is you're trying to convince me of. You basically re-stated what I already was getting at. SE has gone with the mass market approach and molded their game extremely accessible, similar to other games on the market which is the safest route any developer can take. It may be that the majority of gamers don't want a large world to explore, or pesky crafting/gathering jobs playing an important role in the world, or quests that involve more than walking four feet over and picking a few turnips from the ground. The game was remade to try and garner as many players as possible. I'm not under any delusions that this was not the case.

[Mezolitik]

SE has gone with the mass market approach and molded their game extremely accessible, similar to other games on the market which is the safest route any developer can take.

I think there was quite a strong need to go down this path from SE's perspective.

After the average reception for FFXIII and its sequel, and the disastrous launch of FFXIV, they couldn't continue to take risks with their flagship IP. Yoshida said that another mistake like 1.0 FFXIV would finish the company off (IGN).

Going off on a tangent in the MMO world is a huge risk. Look at the Secret World. That was a pretty standard MMO but it was still too weird to gain any kind of mass-market appeal, and now it's F2P.

It wouldn't surprise me if SE continue to play it safe until they recover whatever stupendous sum of money FFXIV has already cost them. After that, we might start to see some more 'out there' features, like Lalafell trebuchet.

[Skotie]

I think there was quite a strong need to go down this path from SE's perspective. It wouldn't surprise me if SE continue to play it safe until they recover whatever stupendous sum of money FFXIV has already cost them. After that, we might start to see some more 'out there' features, like Lalafell trebuchet.

You have a good point but considering it's the mass market here that they're targeting how long can it be expected to hold a large subscription base, or even generate new sales I wonder.

[Royze]

snip

I couldn't agree more on the rationale, but couldn't disagree more on the execution.
FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2 and now FFXIII - LR are horrible games. They completely broke away from FF tradition. FFXII's major sin was turning Avatars such as Odin and Alexander into lame airships. Where is the "Fantasy in that?" But FF12 was still much better than anything after it.

Square soft spent 2 decades building up a fan base and then completely alienated them. We were all 6-10 years old when we started playing Final Fantasy titles. Today we are part of the demographic with disposable income and looking to be entertained more than any previous generation.

Hollywood got it right. Its been nothing but Blockboster Marvel/DC superhero movies for the past 15 years. Avengers anyone?
That demographic is MALE, in mid 20's to early 30's.
SE needs to quit making content exclusively for 15-25 Year Old ADD girls.


EDIT: Before any quotes XIII sales vs FFVII, please remember to look at what % of global sales FFVII represented vs XIII.
The game market has grown exponentially over the past decade. I think it was proven that XIII would have had to done 6x as well sales wise to equal the success of FFVII.

[lololink]

EDIT: Before any quotes XIII sales vs FFVII, please remember to look at what % of global sales FFVII represented vs XIII.
The game market has grown exponentially over the past decade. I think it was proven that XIII would have had to done 6x as well sales wise to equal the success of FFVII.

You said it yourself, you can't compare the sales, in number of sells or in % of global sales, times are differents.

Strangely i didn't like FFXII and liked FFX-2 and the FXIIIs games. That's not because you don't like them that they are terrible ( btw all or most of FF titles, new and olds, are not so good, but nostalgia googles help a lot )

[Edellis]

I couldn't agree more on the rationale, but couldn't disagree more on the execution.
FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2 and now FFXIII - LR are horrible games. They completely broke away from FF tradition. FFXII's major sin was turning Avatars such as Odin and Alexander into lame airships. Where is the "Fantasy in that?" But FF12 was still much better than anything after it.

There was nothing odd about this. The Ivalice titles always had a round-about way of incorporating those types of elements into Final Fantasy, as they have always had their own Avatars to draw from (of which there are plenty to summon and use in-game.) Since Ivalice is a long-running world, it would be pretty hard to incorporate Bahamut/Odin/Alexander into a persistent history as they were in the other FF titles.


The real problem with modern Final Fantasy is that it no longer has a realistic view of its own scale. It seems like the higher-ups of Square Enix want Final Fantasy to be this super dramatic, highly emotionally drawing tale, so all of their focus is on trying to be super popular.


The older games just had naturally compelling stories that never tried to be anything other than a good story. Most importantly, gameplay always came first, and was ultimately used to progress the story MORESO than the storyline itself (coughFFXIIIcough).


This is what happened to Final Fantasy 7, a game with an absolutely amazing script that's been fanserviced and plagued with melodrama (that never existed in the original game) since Square realized they could make tons of money as long as they give Cloud a face in CG and make all the characters sulk around.

[vientown]

Hollywood got it right. Its been nothing but Blockboster Marvel/DC superhero movies for the past 15 years. Avengers anyone?
That demographic is MALE, in mid 20's to early 30's.

disregarding everything else you said: since when was disney's avengers targeted towards 20 - 30 year old men?
i'm sorry that's just ludicrous, just because you can enjoy a thing doesn't mean you are it's target audience. the avengers was targeted to male children and teens, all marvel movies (brightly coloured, well costumed) have been tailored towards a young audience of late. also i'm not sure what other movies you know of that are targeted towards 20-30 year old men and come with excessive disney merchandising, costume lines, young boys clothing lines, a teen drama and a disney channel cartoon (with it's own toy line).

i'm pretty sure they're not trying to catch your attention, unless you're a rather unusual 20-30 year old man. given that you can't understand advertising/marketing in this instance, i'm not inclined to believe your assertions in other instances.

[DarkStaoneDragon]

I couldn't agree more on the rationale, but couldn't disagree more on the execution.
FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2 and now FFXIII - LR are horrible games.

and what does ALL those games have in common? female main roles, sounds like a sexist pig to me, I like FFXIII and X-2. My Wife was in a DF as a Hyur female GLD and no one died or got hate off her, but because a person (probably a dude) was playing as a F Miqote a person said I'm giving it to the catgirl, because, well she's a catgirl, I saw that and was like "the hell?!"