The problem with allowing Turn 2 Rage strat

[synaesthetic]

They're not causing mechanics to fail by exploiting the scripting. The mechanics stop once the "charge complete" message appears. They had to specifically code it that way. Turn 4 has a similar mechanic, except the waves of enemies still fall and all of their attacks still work. I doubt very seriously that this was unintentional; if they wanted to make the twelve-minute timer impassable, then the "charge complete" should have killed everyone instantly. Or the damage of the unavoidable AE would have ramped up after each tick. Or the ADS would continue to use all of its abilities.

It's not an exploit. Is it "cheesing" the encounter? Sure it is. Is it ignoring or bypassing mechanics using specialized gear or class composition? Again, yes. But that's not the same thing as an exploit, such as the Titan HM exploit that would render Titan unable to use any abilities whatsoever.

It's no different than burning Demon Wall down in AK before the adds spawn, or ignoring plumes on Garuda HM during the cyclone phase. It's even less of an exploit than locking mobs out of boss rooms in WP. As an MMO gets older, people get better gear and can ignore mechanics that they were previously unable to ignore.

We should not want Square to punish people for finding creative ways to clear content. My company recently accepted a new member and helped them with their Titan HM run to complete their relic quest. We wiped several times due to the newbie being nervous about performing around people he just met, and as a result he felt very pressured and played poorly. We reset the instance and changed things up, this time using a 1/4/3 instead of a 1/5/2 composition (I switched from BLM to SCH). The newbie had the pressure taken off, and performed considerably better (didn't eat landslide or weight and stayed alive for the entire fight).

If players continue to pressure Squee to restrict how we're "allowed" to clear content, then we'll be considerably more limited in what we can do and how we can do it. The change to the limit break based on class stacking was a heavy-handed way to "force" players to play a certain way. That's poor design. How would you like it if all dungeons, Duty Finder or not, required that your Full Party composition always had to be 2/4/2?

Edit: In the interests of full disclosure, my Coil group does not use the "rage strat." We deal with the mechanics and kill him normally, usually without any problems whatsoever. However, you can't always find two bards. I always have to switch to bard for Turn 2, and if someone's missing then we're boned on interrupts. Having more composition flexibility is a good thing.

[Vodomir]

They're not causing mechanics to fail by exploiting the scripting. The mechanics stop once the "charge complete" message appears. They had to specifically code it that way. Turn 4 has a similar mechanic, except the waves of enemies still fall and all of their attacks still work. I doubt very seriously that this was unintentional; if they wanted to make the twelve-minute timer impassable, then the "charge complete" should have killed everyone instantly. Or the damage of the unavoidable AE would have ramped up after each tick. Or the ADS would continue to use all of its abilities.

It's not an exploit. Is it "cheesing" the encounter? Sure it is. Is it ignoring or bypassing mechanics using specialized gear or class composition? Again, yes. But that's not the same thing as an exploit, such as the Titan HM exploit that would render Titan unable to use any abilities whatsoever.

It's no different than burning Demon Wall down in AK before the adds spawn, or ignoring plumes on Garuda HM during the cyclone phase. It's even less of an exploit than locking mobs out of boss rooms in WP. As an MMO gets older, people get better gear and can ignore mechanics that they were previously unable to ignore.

We should not want Square to punish people for finding creative ways to clear content. My company recently accepted a new member and helped them with their Titan HM run to complete their relic quest. We wiped several times due to the newbie being nervous about performing around people he just met, and as a result he felt very pressured and played poorly. We reset the instance and changed things up, this time using a 1/4/3 instead of a 1/5/2 composition (I switched from BLM to SCH). The newbie had the pressure taken off, and performed considerably better (didn't eat landslide or weight and stayed alive for the entire fight).

If players continue to pressure Squee to restrict how we're "allowed" to clear content, then we'll be considerably more limited in what we can do and how we can do it. The change to the limit break based on class stacking was a heavy-handed way to "force" players to play a certain way. That's poor design. How would you like it if all dungeons, Duty Finder or not, required that your Full Party composition always had to be 2/4/2?

Edit: In the interests of full disclosure, my Coil group does not use the "rage strat." We deal with the mechanics and kill him normally, usually without any problems whatsoever. However, you can't always find two bards. I always have to switch to bard for Turn 2, and if someone's missing then we're boned on interrupts. Having more composition flexibility is a good thing.

I never said it was an exploit and SE has already officially confirmed that they don't see this as an exploit on their end. That still doesn't make the rage method an "intended" strategy in any way.

Comparing this to demon wall or Garuda HM doesn't really fit, as you bypass mechanics in those fights by simply having outgrown the iLvl requirements by a fair margin, so you DPS those encounters fast enough to skip certain mechanics/portions of the fight. That doesn't hold true for the enrage tactic, as you don't DPS too fast for this encounter. You deliberately DPS slowly or even stop DPS completely for the sole reason to bypass mechanics (it's not like this happens accidently or because you are just too fast; you plan on bypassing the mechanics). And to achieve this goal, most groups don't go with a regular setup, but with 3 heals, 1 tank and 4 DPS. That's also for the sole reason to bypass mechanics, not because it fits the fight mechanics better this way. There is a reason for the debuff on the tank, as the fight was actually designed to be played with 2 tanks. I can't see how anyone can refuse to see that is clearly non-intended gameplay. But hey, it's not an exploit, so everyone is free to do what they like, just please stop telling people that this is an intended way of playing this particular encounter, because it's simply not.

As for your Turn 2 anecdote. Why would you need 2 Bards for this fight? We always clear this with just 1 Bard, as your PLD can silence as well. My group runs all of the coil with the exact same setup without any issues.