Classes vs jobs , are classes near obsolete now?

[Raydeus]

Or... they could have just brought a NIN/WAR, pretty much the default NIN tank setup, to be the tank instead of trying to make a party around PLD/NIN.

Kitru's example may have been off (as a WHM, I subbed BLM until SCH came out), but the fact of it still holds true: Sure, you had a huge number of possible job and subjob combinations, but only a few of those options were ever truly viable.

What happens if you don't have a NIN available or if the one needing the fight is the PLD? In XIV you simply wouldn't be able to do it at all. While in XI you had the chance and the option to try to do it differently and adapt to the situation just changing your sub and tweaking your strategy. And too many times it worked with such a wacky setup for me. After all, "Truly viable" is only true until you actually get things done in a different way. (And that's how things like those pesky speed runs were born wasn't it?)

Then it's just about "oh well, yeah, you got the fight done but it would've been easier if you've had the leetest setup!11one" which is ridiculous for obvious reasons.

If you need to get something done it is always better to have options to do it rather than being walled by the limitations. Sometimes it will work and others wont, but even the simple act of trial and error provides emergent content that is not present in a more static game like XIV.

Of course, that doesn't in any way mean you can't actually enjoy having a more linear experience. But from that to actually try to discredit the advantages of having more choices in a game like this (just to excuse the Devs) is simply wrong.


PS > And that's not even counting 1.0's Armory system was even more customizable than XI's since you could take abilities from multiple classes at once without the massive limitations and nerfs present in 2.0. Which brings us back to how pointless the Armory system is right now and how it has become just a vehicle to get you to lvl 30, so you can get your "real" Job and never have to look back at your laughable starting class ever again.

[Exstal]

What happens if you don't have a NIN available or if the one needing the fight is the PLD? In XIV you simply wouldn't be able to do it at all.

They made it so it's possible to do fights with all manner of classes. Easiest? Not a snowball's chance in hell. Possible? For sure.

[Yukiko]

Classes were ment to be for Solo-play and Jobs for Group-play. Thats what Yhoshi-P said himself in 1.x and interviews. Even then you do not gain anything from Cross Classing because you miss the Talents. Therefore it was and is better do stay in your Job. You get laughted at when joining a Level 50 Dungeon without equipped Job-Crystall, even results in leaving Players before combat starts. Forced Group-play then destroyed Solo-Play completely and made Classes useless.

[Duelle]

Originally all you had was class rank and an overall level. It was interesting for a while but very confusing at the same time. Just for giggles I might deck out a Gladiator or Muarader with some HQ crafting gear and penta meld some materia in it.

I've mentioned this before, but I feel the original level and rank system from 1.0 was basically what The Secret World got. "Weapon" level progression separate from base level progression. I sometimes wonder if 1.0 was going to get Jobs the way Decks were implemented in TSW.

What happens if you don't have a NIN available or if the one needing the fight is the PLD?

Then you're SoL because lolPLD pre-Ochain/Aegis. Let's not pretend FFXI encouraged innovation because once the hive mind set its expected curricula, you followed it or were laughed at/ignored.

After all, "Truly viable" is only true until you actually get things done in a different way.

You forget that the context of viable in FFXI was "guaranteed victory so that time spent camping/farming pop items/traveling to the spot is not utterly wasted". That's what pushed people towards specific set ups where the ace jobs reigned and everyone else was worthless.

Of course, that doesn't in any way mean you can't actually enjoy having a more linear experience. But from that to actually try to discredit the advantages of having more choices in a game like this (just to excuse the Devs) is simply wrong.

The more "options" are availab,e the more difficult the game would be to balance, not to mention design of encounters taking a notable hit. FFXI was a clusterfuck on several levels between combat design, possible roles, job balance and things they should have fixed but never did.

Which brings us back to how pointless the Armory system is right now and how it has become just a vehicle to get you to lvl 30, so you can get your "real" Job and never have to look back at your laughable starting class ever again.

As mentioned before, the class is the foundation, the jobs are the branching roles and possibilities of growth for that class. That's more than good enough without making things messy on both players and developers.

[Nahara]

The more "options" are available, the more difficult the game would be to balance, not to mention design of encounters taking a notable hit. FFXI was a clusterfuck on several levels between combat design, possible roles, job balance and things they should have fixed but never did.

Fun case in point: Absolute Virtue. SE created the boss and had an idea of how players should have fought and killed it. Instead, players pulled shenanigans like throwing 18 SCH at it with Modus Veritas or DRKs with Kraken Clubs and Souleater. If you have too many options, it becomes incredibly difficult (if not impossible) to properly balance anything.