Planned Adjustments to PvP

[Rainsworth]

I find gld to be a bit bursty as opposed to pld in battle so classes have their uses.

At the cost of losing Hallowed ground, spirits within and cover? Gladiators don't have the burst of marauders.

[Warthain]

honestly gladiators should stick with paladin.. "Cover" and "Spirits Within" make a ton of difference and sword oath will add a ton of extra dps... they will probably deal more dps than a gladiator and have far more tools to help thier party in pvp.

[Alhanelem]

At the cost of losing Hallowed ground, spirits within and cover? Gladiators don't have the burst of marauders.

They do when you set all the avialable melee DPS buffs, plus GLA's own 30% damage buff.

[Fyreus]

gld and mrd are apples and oranges so saying gld doesn't have their burst when i compare gld to pld is moot. So to cover your points:

Hallowed Ground there are a few things i haven't tested properly but from what i can tell there are player attacks that can go through this. It's possible that CC and magic can go through if this ability is like the FFXI version but i do recall having been killed with this ability up i pvp. There are some good uses for this such as being the last man standing vs 2 dps or another tank (a healer can regen/aero you to death as they kite you so forget them) but it's really situational at best.

Spirits within: Pld's only saving grace and it silences... but the recast is long as hell, normal actions already interupt casts, and if you DO need SW it's for stopping important moves like raise and big heals which would be swiftcasted and if not SW then a normal action can do the job.

Cover: It is worthless. All you can do as a paladin is slow dps and cover, which is currently bugged, it's sucky since pld gears for str at a loss of hp and cover uses your covered targets def as your own which means you're gonna take an even FASTER beating.

That being said no way am i giving the ability to remove 70% of a healers hp in 8 secs away for a 10 sec ability, a stupid ability, and SW which is easily replaced by impulse drive (damage wise) while chasing something down. If you get a chance try raging strikes+FoF+straight shot + internal release + impulse drive on people kiting you and laugh as you crit them for 200-300 every few secs and you'll never equip your stone in pvp again.

*edit* this ^ is against those fully geared tanks and from behind so imagine clothies oh and i forgot to add in invigorate for chasing something down at a pivotal moment.

[Rainsworth]

marauder take out their soul crystal because they dont gain a single usefull ability from their warrior job to use in pvp... defiance lowers damage by 20%, inner beast, is good but you lose dps in every other skill, steel cyclone , useless... infuriate and unchained nothing good in here...

honestly gladiators should stick with paladin.. "Cover" and "Spirits Within" make a ton of difference and sword oath will add a ton of extra dps... they will probably deal more dps than a gladiator and have far more tools to help thier party in pvp.

Exactly!

snip

Too bad you lose too much for trying to be a wannabe marauder. You don't have holmgang, no butcher's block (hits like a truck) and shield bash is not off GCD. On paper it may seem that GLD is a viable class for pvp but in practice this is not the case. Stick with your paladin.

[SofiyaGlaston]

Exactly!



Too bad you lose too much for trying to be a wannabe marauder. You don't have holmgang, no butcher's block (hits like a truck) and shield bash is not off GCD. On paper it may seem that GLD is a viable class for pvp but in practice this is not the case. Stick with your paladin.

Just want to throw out there:
Rage of Halone is the paladin's "Butcher's Block" and it has 20 more potency tacked on. also, stun being spammable (and timable) is a lot better than 1 off the gcd every 20s or so.

MRD is better for more damage. PLD doesnt need to go gld for more damage cause its more of a utility tank with -some- damage behind it. Trying to make a MRD out of it ruins its true usefulness. Overall, still agreeing that MRD > WAR and PLD > GLD.

[Fyreus]

In a month or so from now people will catch on to what's going on. Nothing is worst than having your prey stunned and unable to move and all you can do is use 2 abilities (think gcd timer) for 100 -> 200 dmg before having to reapply stun when you could have done 180 -> 180 and have more crit/dmg.

*edit* other than stun and a possible pacification i really don't find any utility besides stun :/ if anything we have the ability to harass people and keep healers busy and stand there with a stunned target with very little kill power (iirc killing is important).

Deep down i feel as though mrds are using this whimsical excuse as 'payback' from pve related issues.

[Rainsworth]

snip

GLD and MRD are only 2 tank classes in the game, 1 being more defensive and the other one being more offensive so yes you can compare them. Good paladins know when to use cover and spirits within (I'm speaking from a 3-4 man queueing point of view, not solo queueing). As for hallowed ground, it does work in pvp. I don't know if it removes DOTs that were currently on you prior to using the ability but it does work in pvp that's for sure. The skill description does say that it blocks MOST attacks, not all. I'm not saying that you can't play as a GLD in pvp but you're gimping yourself. 200-300 hits every few secs is easily healable. Feel free to post your gladiator video but in my mind, GLD are gimping themselves trying to be wannabee DPS.

ust want to throw out there:
Rage of Halone is the paladin's "Butcher's Block" and it has 20 more potency tacked on. also, stun being spammable (and timable) is a lot better than 1 off the gcd every 20s or so.

MRD is better for more damage. PLD doesnt need to go gld for more damage cause its more of a utility tank with -some- damage behind it. Trying to make a MRD out of it ruins its true usefulness. Overall, still agreeing that MRD > WAR and PLD > GLD.

That's correct. Paladins are not killers but they are a pain in the ass to healers.

[Fyreus]

GLD and MRD are only 2 tank classes in the game, 1 being more defensive and the other one being more offensive so yes you can compare them. Good paladins know when to use cover and spirits within (I'm speaking from a 3-4 man queueing point of view, not solo queueing). As for hallowed ground, it does work in pvp. I don't know if it removes DOTs that were currently on you prior to using the ability but it does work in pvp that's for sure. The skill description does say that it blocks MOST attacks, not all. I'm not saying that you can't play as a GLD in pvp but you're gimping yourself[/b]. 200-300 hits every few secs is easily healable. Feel free to post your gladiator video but in my mind, GLD are gimping themselves trying to be wannabee DPS.

Then what are you doing? Cover is bugged and cover+hallowed ground doesn't do what it should on paper. At best you are describing a damage-less participant who shouldn't focus on damage but should use their 30 sec abilities, their auto attacks, and cover a healer knowing very well the only 2 ways you can over your healer is to TAKE damage from holmgang OR intercept damage on the coat tails of a healer.

- In the first scenario it's best to stun the warrior since holmgang is only 6 seconds and by time the stun lands they'll be 2 seconds in so that allows the healer to escape instead of taking shots to the face.
- The second scenario you'd have to coordinate (or walk away from the other team's healer) a kite to get in range or try to sprint into range to absorb some hits. Know what i do the moment i see cover? I attack from in front or get between the two and i find that more and more people are doing so.

So now that we know cover only 'works' if everyone is in an ideal position, which we all know is never the case in pvp. So lets move on to the ever so situational Hallowed Ground.
-It negates most damage.
Since Cover+Hallowed Ground means you take the TARGETS damage ratings, this combo doesn't work which leaves HG to a situation where there are 1 or 2 people remaining or a very close tie. Since you only get hit once in a while as a paladin or even dead last like the average fight this ability remains situational or for those rare occasions.

So we finally arrive at the only worthwhile move that's decent to use. Having critted a mnk in the back with this for 670dmg i will admit it's pretty nice to use once in a while. Having locked down a pve geared whm and not being able to destroy them properly on the way and at the destination i can say paladin is lacking--but we do have utilities!

-Stun
-Silence (only useful for Surecast+Equanimity countered by stun/glory slash)
-Flash

66% of these don't hold a candle to actual utility like heavy/bind/sleep/heal debuff/etc but the least effective one is used by the least effective arena job. I'll make a comparison video when i have spare time but i promise you won't see anything nice about paladin in comparison to gld.

I will also admit i did help a blm use sleepga in a corner with cover active (this was planned) but me not being on the healer allowed the other healer to wake them so that once upon a time rare situation really wasn't so helpful tbh.

[Warthain]

Hallowed works against every skills being cast after hallowed is deployed, current dots and skills used during hallowed animation before the buff is counting will still go through and kill you in the process if your hp is low... i just dont know if after hallowed is deployed if any dots you have are still hitting you or if they get removed/do no damage.