Every PVP MMO normalizes gear in PVP

[Davionx]

Gear advantages in an instanced set up fight with even numbers per side is counter productive.

[Worm]

It's kind of sad to watch each side launch hyperbole.

Gear balancing isn't that bad and it'd be pretty easy to do, the game already devalues gear when you level sync, so it's possible to devalue to a certain item level. It really would be an easy fix. It's been done in enough other games (like vanity slots) to insist on some chilling effect.

I don't really know that forcing people through a PVE grind to have the best PVP gear is necessarily hardcore or meaningful. Also I'm pretty sure PVE Progression won't be "killed" because that gear doesn't give you an edge in PVP. At a glance it's sort of unfair to people who don't like PVE content as much as they like PVP. I think the go play something else argument here is especially pathetic, since if this was implemented with some gear scaling you'd be seeing it thrown in the opposite direction just as quick.

I did sort of overlook the devaluing of PVP gear earned form the PVP but if most PVE stuff is going to be better it's already pretty devalued as is, isn't it?

[Daenerys_Sedai]

To address the good doctor above, I understand that it may not be a current issue, but it is an inevitable one simply due to how the system is currently set up.

Anyway, it sounds like you guys may be looking for something to keep you interested and continue playing. If there were other types of rewards that didn't affect combat, then would you be agreeable to gear normalization? If the answer is 'no,' and that you want to have higher level gear to give you the ability to match up against an undergeared person, then I guess I can see how the stomping appeals to some. There are other games that have this PvP system and many people find it rewarding and enjoyable. It's not for me. I just think, that as one who wants to play for skill, you don't want to have field and respond to criticisms like: "you guys won because you outgeared the other team." You remove that criticism with gear normalization. Again, though, some people like this aspect of PvP--it's just not for me.

To say that you NEED gear progression to keep people interested in PvP, is a little far stretched and that maybe, you're not really looking for a real PvP experience. Take the Fighting Game Community (holla SRK!), Super Street Fighter II Turbo is STILL being played at international competitions. From a system point of view, your Sagat has the same chance of winning as John Choi's Sagat. It's not like Choiboy's Sagat (system-wise) is better than yours because he's been playing longer and has been able to gear it up. Nope. it's going to be the skill he brings to the table. How LESS EPIC would the Daigo-Wong EVO 2004 SF 3rd Strike moment be, if Daigo's Ken had parry+100 gear on?

[Dhex]

How LESS EPIC would the Daigo-Wong EVO 2004 SF 3rd Strike moment be, if Daigo's Ken had parry+100 gear on?

For anyone that doesn't know what Daenerys is talking about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeM0rH_4ung

[Ryans]

Go spend 30k on lvl 55 pvp gear. It is at least on par with lvl 90 pve gear for pvp.

[ROOTFayth]

this question anticipates a subjective answer.
One could just as easily ask: what's the point of PvPing if there is no gear normalization?

People will PvP for different reasons. GW 1 and GW 2 seem to have invested quite a bit of money thinking that gear normalization was a good thing.

obviously because you strive to get better gears

also PvP where gears are normalized without a ladder seems absolutely pointless

[Daenerys_Sedai]

obviously because you strive to get better gears

also PvP where gears are normalized without a ladder seems absolutely pointless

I think you missed the point of my post you quoted..

anyway, I've said my piece. It's all circles from here on out anyway.

[Dhex]

I agree with both sides of this argument; the few PVP matches I've done the other team vastly "out geared" any duty team with pieces of PVP gear (morale) and we were trounced. I wouldn't want to take the sense of achievement away either - but I think that sense of achievement should come from well fought matches...


It's frustrating watching everyone else die on your team; and it's depressing to see you out DPS'd your entire team. At one point the matches were so imbalanced I ended up just /sitting and let them wail on my face rather than try and run because everyone else had already got wrecked at an alarming rate.

I'm not a huge PVP enthusiast anymore but I was looking forward to it - but I missed out on day one. Already people have more skills and gear than I can feasibly overcome with skill - so I've decided to step back and only play when pre-made groups of friends want to play. Doing the lower level cap and getting the crafted gear might alleviate some of this but it's just surprising how quickly it became lopsided (in some cases).

Sense of progression and "winning" is important - but having fun is key. If PVP is blindingly frustrating with a steep entry curve it dies out.

[Ryios]

Want fair PVP, go play something else. You can hardly say this game is PVP oriented because it has one arena... Il90 Gear should allow you to beat the crap out of someone in il70. The one exception would be if someone has the pvp set's with moralre on it (thats what it's there for) they are harder to beat on.

What do you propose they do to fix this? Disable pve gear from being war in there at all?

Also, Wow.. at least when I played, did the same thing. There was PVP gear sure. But to get it you had to PVP with PVE Gear on and work your way up. And many many times a new tier set would come out, e.g. 10 and 10.5. You could have full 10.5 and go to PVP and wreck people.

[Trell]

+1 for the OP's view on this. The feeling about this is not as unanimous as some of you in the vertical grind bubble think. Normalizing gear in sPVP isn't a controversial idea and plenty of people prefer that because it emphasizes skill over grind. That's not to say it makes ARR's sPVP unplayable - just not as great for some.