Huge SMN nerf: we're losing Thunder

[Madoka]

1. Damage buffs are not potency buffs. 80 potency from me is 200 damage. 80 potency from someone else could be 150 or 250. That 20% damage boost makes mine 240, the high end 300 and the low end 180. The 20% means more as your damage goes up. So to a well geared SMN boosted thunder does a hell of a lot more than boosted ruins
2. Anyone who thinks Thunder is not a huge part of SMN was a bad SMN.

[MakotoNano]

1. Damage buffs are not potency buffs. 80 potency from me is 200 damage. 80 potency from someone else could be 150 or 250. That 20% damage boost makes mine 240, the high end 300 and the low end 180. The 20% means more as your damage goes up. So to a well geared SMN boosted thunder does a hell of a lot more than boosted ruins
2. Anyone who thinks Thunder is not a huge part of SMN was a bad SMN.

The amount of "I dont even use Thunder" is just baffling to me.
Might as well be saying "Yeah I like to be bad at my class and do limited damage."
"When I play PLD I don't use Flash"
"Whats blood for blood" - BRD

[Gamemako]

Damage buffs are not potency buffs...

I'm not sure what you're suggesting here. Potency is effectively a multiplier. With the same job and stats, an attack with 300 potency will do exactly 3 times as much damage as an attack with 100 potency. Because it applies to all abilities equally, the ratio does not change. An attack with 300 potency buffed by Raging Strikes will still do exactly 3 times as much damage as an attack with 100 potency buffed by Raging Strikes.

[Peptaru]

Madoka is doing what many, many people do. Comparing the extra, say randomly, 40 -actual- damage thunder gets from a potency buff as being more valuable than someone with less gear getting only a extra -actual- 20. But in math land, where stuff gets real. . . 20% is 20% is 20%, and 320 is 3.2x as strong as 100. The only hiccup is thunder extension from contagion beyond the RS buff duration, but that too can easily be mathed in both optimal and suboptimal number of ticks.

[Millimidget]

Don't give them that idea.

Give it to them? I'm sure they already thought of it and are saving it.

[Ryuko]

The amount of "I dont even use Thunder" is just baffling to me.

Me too! There are people saying they've actually removed it from the bar because of how useless it is. I don't know, but using Thunder always made sense... We've become a DoT class, so an extra DoT is nice. Also, the damage from the DoT becomes the reason Thunder is better than just throwing another Ruin. Constantly-ticking DoTs are always preferable to direct damage, especially when MP is considered. I'll miss Thunder because, while it wasn't necessarily a SUMMONER ability, the DoT aspect made sense with our class. Blizzard 2 makes me feel kind of weird, especially its similarity to Tri-Disaster. The only real thing taking a hit by the Thunder nerf is single-target DPS (since Thunder doesn't spread with Bane), so why are they then buffing our AoE? Our AoE was lower than BLM, but our single-target was equal if not superior. Now our AoE and single-target will be lacking.

[MakotoNano]

text above^

What gets me is. Thunder is JUST as strong as our other dots. If you think thunder is useless you might as well not cast any of your dots and just spam Ruin, Ruin II, and Energy Drain.

[Oppiukam]

Greetings everyone!

We see there have been valid points made during this conversation. However, some of the posts have become targeted and insulting to other players. If this sort of behavior continues we will be forced to unapprove this thread, which unfortunately removes all the valid points as well as the negative ones. Feel free to post your opinions in a constructive manner so we can all express our ideas and thoughts!

-GM Oppiukam

[Duuude007]

Even with removing Thunder, SMN DPS is superior to BLM dps. I don't see the problem.

[Xairos]

Even with removing Thunder, SMN DPS is superior to BLM dps. I don't see the problem.

I think this was the intent of those who said "I wont miss Thunder". My dps was still good without Thunder, so this is hardly a strong nerf. A reduction of potential yes.