Huge SMN nerf: we're losing Thunder

[jars]

you don't get compensated for nerfs. that's not how they work.

they could do something to increase the interactivity loss from thunder though.

[Kalandros]

Thunder takes up too much MP for summoner and we don't have Blizzard to get it back quickly.

Then you managed your mana poorly.
Twintania without double bards and I rarely had issues with mana, the one time I did was because I used Resurrect in phase 5 (final) when one black mage died to the 5x hellfire

Thunder WAS always part of my rotation - whenever I setup my first [Bio I] I had thunder before it - and after using Bane, I'd throw Thunder on the other targets.

Energy drain was used of course, because you shouldn't be using Fester on all 3 stacks in every fight of the game.
I speak more of Twintania here but to burst down the Conflagrations, I would Bane, Fester, Energy Drain - using all 3 stacks to burst the 2nd and 4th conflags.

This gave me a bit of mana back on top of the greater gain from using Aetherflow on cooldown.

Management of your abilities is important.
But anyway, I can do without Thunder (:

[AjoraOak]

That was likely the point. This was making BRD essential for endgame content, or at least worth vastly more than its slot. I do think RoD could use some tweaking from here, though. 180TP for that? Garuda better have a hell of an evasion buff hiding under those tailfeathers.

Actually, the reason obviously was to provide extra reason to bring a warrior to a raid since they got the debuff now. It feels more like they just tossed bard something random they knew would never be needed really.

[Madoka]

I'm more worried that you have to be so dependent on a CC skill to have it so integral, that's all.

It's a cross class skill we would always have. There is no way we would not have it. We have to level THM to 15 to become SMN. We are going to have Thunder no matter what. We are the DoT class, it only makes sense for us to rely on thunder. To argue that we shouldn't have to rely on it when we literally have to get it to become a SMN is idiotic and you may as well remove the requirement to level another class to access a Job. What if SCH Lost Cleric stance and gained Raise? It would be just as useless and be the exact same change we're getting.

This "10-15%" thing really needs to die. If 8 potency per second is 15% of your DPS, then you're doing about 120 DPS with a relic+1 and really need to re-evaluate your playing skill. What you've actually lost is more like 5-7% of your DPS.

It is literally 10-11% pure potency. With Garuda, all Dots up and using Ruin we put out 325 potency every 3 seconds. 350 including shadow flare (which we can't use on sleeping mobs anymore). Losing Thunder puts us at 290-315, which are 11% and 10% losses respectively. This is purely the potency we deal every 3 seconds in normal rotation.

[AjoraOak]

I think it's pretty obvious summoner isn't loved :'( they just used it to badly copy another WoW class and taking another DoT away just makes it that much more boring.

[Gamemako]

It is literally 10-11% pure potency. With Garuda, all Dots up and using Ruin we put out 325 potency every 3 seconds. 350 including shadow flare (which we can't use on sleeping mobs anymore). Losing Thunder puts us at 290-315, which are 11% and 10% losses respectively. This is purely the potency we deal every 3 seconds in normal rotation.

Oh? Now, this is a bit rudimentary (spherical cows and that), but assuming no DoT downtime, in 360 seconds, you would use 12 BioII, 12 Shadow Flare, 15 Miasma, 20 Bio out of 144 GCDs, leaving 85 for Ruin. Then add just the basic 100 potency per 3s attack from Garuda and 3 uses of Fester per minute. That's 4200 + 3000 + 4500 + 4800 + 6800 + 12000 + 5400 = 40700 potency per 360s. You could previously replace 20 Ruin with Thunder at a gain of 160 per, which is 3200, totaling 43900. Thus, the reduction ration would be 40700/43900 = 0.9271. The nerf would then be 7.3%. Have I forgotten something?

(Not that I don't find it strange that SMN was nerfed, what with it being required for absolutely nothing.)

[GilbertLapine]

You also gain Blizzard II at 50 potency

That's a huge buff to your AOE damage.

[Taaz]

Oh? Now, this is a bit rudimentary (spherical cows and that), but assuming no DoT downtime, in 360 seconds, you would use 12 BioII, 12 Shadow Flare, 15 Miasma, 20 Bio out of 144 GCDs, leaving 85 for Ruin. Then add just the basic 100 potency per 3s attack from Garuda and 3 uses of Fester per minute. That's 4200 + 3000 + 4500 + 4800 + 6800 + 12000 + 5400 = 40700 potency per 360s. You could previously replace 20 Ruin with Thunder at a gain of 160 per, which is 3200, totaling 43900. Thus, the reduction ration would be 40700/43900 = 0.9271. The nerf would then be 7.3%. Have I forgotten something?

(Not that I don't find it strange that SMN was nerfed, what with it being required for absolutely nothing.)

How do I numbers liek you

[MakotoNano]

The problem is, a nerf wasn't needed. If they wanted to give us blizzard II why didn't they take away the stupid bard skill that gives us 15% physical accuracy / Dexterity .. and give us blizzard. At least then we'd have a useful 5th CC skill.

[BlaiseArath]

I have to admit, watching the only job i thoroughly enjoyed playing get a rather unneeded nerf is rather disappointing.

I mean I technically began playing the job because I wanted to use Carbuncle, only to find out he was replaced by Chicken Nugget man and a 5 year olds Windy Stick figure art project... but still, the job itself was interesting enough despite being "Necromancers according to Square Enix".

Eh...