melee dps buffs + bard nerf = cumulative effect too much?

[Cynric]

Black, you shouldn't be so hard on the guy - some folks really do think that having to move behind the mob from time to time is hard and "requires skill".

every single class in the game except bard must halt everything to dodge an aoe. Bard keeps on pewin, pressing one button and buffs most of the time, throwing a dot here or there, then going back to heavy shot. How is this hard? Is the button you have heavy shot mapped to broken? Every job regardless of being what I would consider difficult is still harder than bard .

[Zellata]

every single class in the game except bard must halt everything to dodge an aoe.

This doesn't require any extra skill - every single class has to hit movement button in order to dodge, the fact that some can't shoot on the run doesn't make them any harder to play. It just changes how they do damage (in bursts vs. continuous).

Bard keeps on pewin, pressing one button and buffs most of the time, throwing a dot here or there, then going back to heavy shot. How is this hard?

All classes have roughly the same number of buttons to press, bard is no exception. I never said that it's hard, on the contrary, all classes/jobs in FFXIV are extremely easy. Saying that some job in this game "requires skill" is akin to saying that using a spoon requires some skill aside from not being "slow and special".

[Aaramis]

Playing both DRG and BRD, I have noticed a difference with AoEs, but honestly, it's not a huge difference. The only ones you get interrupted on are the circle AoEs, and for those you're generally only losing one attack - which can interrupt dps if it's the second or third attack in a chain, but it's not a huge dps drop. Given that the dps is ahead of BRD to begin with, you still come out on top in the end with the interrupted attack chains, but requires just a bit more attention to stay alive.

IMO, DRG (and MNK for that matter) aren't as challenging as some would make it think, but BRD by the same token isn't as brain-dead as those same people would have you believe. They both require attention to maximise dps - melee to avoid AoEs and keep their self-buffs/enemy debuffs up, and complete their attack chains; and archer to watch for procs, keep DoTs up, play songs when needed, etc.
Neither one requires a brain surgeon level of intellect to play properly.

[Viridiana]

every single class in the game except bard must halt everything to dodge an aoe.

That's patently false. BLM has Scathe, Firestarter, and Thundercloud; SMN has Bio, Ruin II, Fester, Energy Drain, Bane, and all of their pet DPS. Not to mention both those classes can Swiftcast 1/minute anything they want to.

As far as melee, even the Titan fight, which is held as basically the standard pro-BRD fight, has large swathes of time in which melee can maintain 100% uptime while dodging AOEs. The only times I can think of where a melee has to fully break contact with Titan are when Weight completely covers his hit box, and certain bomb configurations.

[Cynric]

That's patently false. BLM has Scathe, Firestarter, and Thundercloud; SMN has Bio, Ruin II, Fester, Energy Drain, Bane, and all of

No one is saying the other classes cant keep up their dps if they try to do so as you noted. Bard just has a much easier time doing so, I always see Bard mains get so defensive for saying Bard is easy. Being an easy class isnt a bad thing. Bard cant top the damage the other dps classes do, but those classes generally do more work than bard to attain that damage. Bard has the benefits of both melee and ranged. Its a pretty stress free job.

There isnt a lot most classes have to deal with here and that is true. Melees worry about positioning and dodging more often, tanks worry about well yeah, healers worry about the party, summoner worries about a bigger dot upkeep than the other classes and proper timing of said dots, blm has a few tools to use but not enough for movement heavy things without pre planning,

Bard worries about normal stuff, buff upkeep ,debuff upkeep, a few DoTs, and if they need to dodge well, they just move and dont need to stop doing what they were doing, its safe to just continue attacking, the real kicker is the one thing they cant control is probably where their actual dps strength comes from which is purely based off of rng, and while that kinda sucks it doesnt add anything stressful you can control other than playing normally and making sure your dots are buffed by IR when you can.

[Viridiana]

No one is saying the other classes cant keep up their dps if they try to do so as you noted. Bard just has a much easier time doing so, I always see Bard mains get so defensive for saying Bard is easy. Being an easy class isnt a bad thing.

I'm not going to argue that we're a difficult class. Honestly, I'm not sure which classes I'd argue *are* difficult, but that's beside the point. I just don't want people getting the idea that somehow BRD is the single, solitary class that can DPS while moving, because we aren't. The fact is, the only time that a dodgeable AOE affects the dps of a melee is when there's no safe spot near the enemy to stand.

[Cynric]

I'm not going to argue that we're a difficult class. Honestly, I'm not sure which classes I'd argue *are* difficult, but that's beside the point. I just don't want people getting the idea that somehow BRD is the single, solitary class that can DPS while moving, because we aren't. The fact is, the only time that a

No but look at all the examples you yourself cited, blm has to do these skills or hope for this proc to dps while moving, healers must use certain skills to heal while moving from AoEs, Melees have to find a safe spot as you have said while dealing with positioning or completely disengage at risk of losing major buffs or their place in rotation. None of these jobs can play their best while moving. Bur what changes between a bard playing his or her best and having to dodge? Well theyre moving, they dont need to pre plan and dont need an extra bonus skill, they play the exact same while dodging as they do standing still.

Does this make bard broken? No, just less stressful and through that stress level it makes it a bit easier to know what to do as a bard. No one is claiming what melees and the other classes do to be the hardest thing in the world. What I am saying and have been said is that Bard deals with very little of those same things to begin with. No cast times, but stays out of range of most AoE, no poisitioning on the target to mess around with. Just gotta play normal and when needed to sing bards are often told to do so, then they sing , and nothing changes how they play even then except the damage they do.

[Viridiana]

snip

You realize that I was pretty much explicitly arguing against your earlier assertion that all the other classes have to halt everything in order to dodge, right? Once you conceded that they don't, I no longer have any reason to continue this argument. I'll leave the relative difficulties of the various classes to another discussion.

[Cynric]

You realize that I was pretty much explicitly arguing against your earlier assertion that all the other classes have to halt everything in order to dodge, right? Once you conceded that they don't, I no longer have any reason to continue this argument. I'll leave the relative difficulties of the various classes to another discussion.

I guess the more correct wording would have been Bard can play optimum either way, the other jobs can not play their best while moving and must adapt new strategies, pre plan, or completely stop doing damage, where Bard can stay static and constant in what Bard does while moving or dodging an AoE. As far as the discussion about difficulty, Im sure we can save that for another day. All of what I said still stands though, People , not you of course, can call me stupid, a liar, whatever I dont really care, It doesnt change the facts about Bard as a whole.

[BrandoH]

A bunch of wrong words.

We have to manage about as much stuff as a BLM, and I don't see anyone bitching about that faceroll job. And don't give me that "we have more utility" crap that Yoshi gave us. 2 of our 3 songs have such a ridiculously specialized role that we use them a few times a week at best. And we can't maintain them for any large period of time. What's the point in nerfing our already not-chart-topping DPS when our "Support" role is mediocre as fuck?

I'm not losing my raid spot over it, I'm smart and geared more than one class, but it's really stupid that they're nerfing a class that doesn't need it, and buffing another class that doesn't need it. The only good changes they're making is the fix to Jump animations.