SMN - Why it is not a very interesting job and not a good upgrade from ACN

[Taerra]

Damn right it is, in my opinion, I don't call what they devised at the moment a summoner, not by tradition at least. I agree that in the end, SE has the big end of the stick, but why stick to an image for so many titles and then warp it completely ?

The summons always had a bigger part to play than the summoner itself or equal in most of the titles. This is not the case in ffxiv, and I'm not talking about the primal themselves here.

If you suck at the game pick BLM, otherwise whichever one you prefer. Both are desirable.

And lol ... you must be a warlock/WoW fanboy.

[Kevee]

The summons always had a bigger part to play than the summoner itself or equal in most of the titles. This is not the case in ffxiv, and I'm not talking about the primal themselves here.

No it didn't.

Not if you knew what you were doing.

[Aphrini]

The subject of SMN is very, very touchy to so many of us as we grew up on. SMN is my fave job with WHM just barely behind, I think it is clearly understandable why people could be upset with this job as earlier stated it has always been a huge part of FF lore. I ran what was likely the largest SMN ls in FFXI history my SMN ls was my everything and SMN job was also. Coming here to FFXIV at first I was like wtf?? I have fallen in love with the job and adore throwing on my horn and going to work. Similar to when FFVIII changed them or when FFX made it so they fought on their own in lieu of your party, all things at first where I was like wtf, and later fell in love with.

[Taerra]

No it didn't.

Not if you knew what you were doing.

ffx - Yuna - taking control of summons ?
FFIX - Garnet was a summoner/white, big emphasis on summons during the game/lore (odin destroying the world tree)
FF tactics - Complete wreckage of the battlefield.
Same applies to FF3-4-5-6 (espers, again main focus of storyline), even 7 summoning was key, big damage at the cost of big MP.


I dunno, guess we have to agree to disagree, I just don't like the vision of smn in ffxiv. The lore and primals are one thing, Egi's are another. You know, I wouldn't be complaining so much if they gave us a decent basic role (nuke or heal) + a stronger enkindle or tweak some aspects of the Egi. I guess the real bother is the DoT aspect. Nope, not cutting it for me.

[Madoka]

FF3 - conjurer/evoker. Summons either have a black or a white effect. Whites tended to buff or debuff, black would attack and ignore monster defense. But what you got was random
Then it upgrades into Summoner, summoner's only summon monsters to use their signature moves.
Then it kind of upgrades into Sage which gets white, black and summons.

FF4 - Rydia. Summons and Black magic. She was definitely a nuker and while Bio/Virus was nice for damage at points (and op in TAY) you drop it for tier 3 spells, leviathan, bahamut and flare end game. Asura and Sylph being more support summons than damage

FF5- A job where you can summon any summon you have bested in battle and buy a few too. Probably the most utility they've ever had with Golem automatically blocking damage, sylph doing the same from 4, carbuncle casting reflect. Still a nuker though

ff6- Anyone can summon their equipped esper once per battle, most of them just do damage but a few offer great support like casting blink on the party and such.

ff7 -anyone can summon and I believe they all just did damage.

Ff8 - Same here, though you could boost their damage if you learned the skill to give their long animations some purpose

FF9 - Eiko and Garnet are both hybrid WHM and Summoners. With Eiko being a better whm and Garnet being a better SMN

FFX - Yuna is another white mage and summoner. This also being the first time summons are playable and take over the party's spot when summoned

FFXI - Took the Yuna step further and about all you do is fight through your summon. Each summon has different roles and useful situations

FFXII - If you find and defeat an esper in combat, then teach it to somebody they can summon the esper by using their quickening bars and again only the summoner and summon are on the field like with Yuna. They fight either for a period of time, or until it or the summoner dies. In the original espers followed their own gambit set. in IZJS you can change their gambits to control them better.

FFXIII - Bikes

So really the FFXIV is different but fine. More often than not the summons were just there as support for the summoner, even the iconic Rydia. The only cases where the summon overshadowed the summoner were 10 and 11

[Aphrini]

I would also point out that the general consensus in FFXI was lolSMN, I am happy that my group was able to prove that stigma wrong but trust me when I tell you the SMN bitch thread has a very loooong history. Though the FFXIV SMN is not nearly as situational as the FFXI for previously stated reasons though I LOVE my SMN in XI and XIV.

[Aphrini]

Also you guys forgot FF1 SMN the job was not born yet but even then Bahamut was rocking the world and even back then the SOB was King.

[Kevee]

ffx - Yuna - taking control of summons ?
FFIX - Garnet was a summoner/white, big emphasis on summons during the game/lore (odin destroying the world tree)
FF tactics - Complete wreckage of the battlefield.
Same applies to FF3-4-5-6 (espers, again main focus of storyline), even 7 summoning was key, big damage at the cost of big MP.


I dunno, guess we have to agree to disagree, I just don't like the vision of smn in ffxiv. The lore and primals are one thing, Egi's are another. You know, I wouldn't be complaining so much if they gave us a decent basic role (nuke or heal) + a stronger enkindle or tweak some aspects of the Egi. I guess the real bother is the DoT aspect. Nope, not cutting it for me.

In everything you listed Summons are useless and the person using them is better off doing other things.

[pandabearcat]

Kevee what ever happened to your face? It doesn't show up anymore.

Also: the bane change is a tooltip change and so nothing is actually happening with summoners.

The previous change to allow pet commands to be used while using casted abilities was a pretty big buff.

Their motivation for dropping bane is fairly unfounded but there really isn't a reason to fight it as SMN wins any cleave fight.

At least they aren't going the way of WoW where multidotting is almost entirely worthless.

[Babydoll]

I dunno about you guys but when I think of a Final Fantasy Summoner..what comes to mind is the giant creatures who come in, do a powerful attack in a mini cutscene (Or whatever) and then disappear. I do not remember them for their white/black magic..LOL. I remember having Rydia cast virus cuz I used to think the sound it made was funny as a kid..>.> Haha..and I barely remember Garnet healing, its been so long but I know she did for sure! ; ; One thing I DO remember for sure is the huge summons and such, especially Alexander from FF9. I always used Summoning with Garnet and Eiko.

I don't think of a Final Fantasy Summoner and say "Oh a healer, cool" except with FFXI..lmao. Aphrini I ran an all SMN LS on FFXI too since 2003..hehe mine was called Godhand ^^

However...to do that in FFXIV would be silly. I mean..I don't get it. Can you imagine having the huge, true form of Ifrit in AK and dying to those Howling Lights (Or whatever its called..those balls of light) it would be a joke. I think SMN is okay in FFXIV..it needs some tweaking sure but meh...I don't think there is really a practical way of putting traditional FF summoners into a MMO. Just my opinion. <3

The previous change to allow pet commands to be used while using casted abilities was a pretty big buff.

Well, how do you explain what Rein said?

-“YoshiP mentions in 2.1 SMN’s Bane will increase.” So good for them!

I don't think he would lie or mistranslated something like that o.O Again, taken from here: http://omedon.tumblr.com/post/689910...erview-details And you can ask him on twitter...o.o With SE you never know...*shrugs*