[Petition] We want Red Mage!

[Serdapi]

So many better classes need to come first before RDM.

[MartaDemireux]

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Yoshi has said doesn't like Haste and likely won't implement it for players. If he did it should go to Time Mage I think. Enemy PGL's get it because they don't build GL stacks. Any "spike" spells should go to a tank, DPS shouldn't be getting hit. "enspells" are Mystic Knight territory, they could fill the tank role and get the spikes as well. Dispel and Refresh are fine but I'm afraid they'd fall back into being Refresh slaves. Also having it come off of GLA gives them a world of defensive cooldowns without a whole lot of use behind them. Just my 2 cents.

[Tanama]

Also having it come off of GLA gives them a world of defensive cooldowns without a whole lot of use behind them. Just my 2 cents.

Remember, Yoshi P gave that example if Dark Knight were to come from Marauder they could change the base skills to be more Dark Knight related. So new jobs won't be restricted by their base class.

[Wolf_Gang]

snip.

SCH already have a form of AOE haste. I'd bet money we're going to see a single target cast of it in some form in the future.

RDM has primarily been a debuffer / buffer. I'd see it's role being similar to Bards. It can keep blaze spikes on the tank, dispel boss and buff group with enthunder/refresh. Just like it did in FFXI.

I only mentioned 2 but in reality, a lot of Gladiator skills will morph into other functionality when they do add another job to the class.

[Babydoll]

Speak for yourself...I want a dagger class! >.> When they do give us RDM though I hope they do it right. Please please do not clone a WoW job like you did with my favorite class, SMN ; ; SE..be innovative for once!

[Borfin]

Unsure how it would be balanced (as I stated earlier) while still maintaining the flavor of the class (they butchered SMN's flavor, after all).

But I add my voice to the throng; RDM plox. Maybe something along the lines of a Magic Knight with Doublecast for cross-class skills or something, idfk.

So many better classes need to come first before RDM.

RDM is the one and only FFI class that isn't present in the game (aside from Ninja, and it's a lot more iconic to the series than Ninja is)

[Tanama]

RDM has primarily been a debuffer / buffer. I'd see it's role being similar to Bards. It can keep blaze spikes on the tank, dispel boss and buff group with enthunder/refresh. Just like it did in FFXI.

That's only been their role in FFXI. Everywhere else they've been adept at swordplay with knowledge of both white and black magic along with their signature skill Double Cast for the most part.

I really, really hope Yoshida does not echo that abomination of a job they call Red Mage from Final Fantasy XI.

[MartaDemireux]

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Oh I know. If you read my ideas in my signature I incorporate that use liberally. I think defensive abilities should stay for DRK since they're using their HP already to do damage; they will need that defensive boost from time to time. Now, if RDM were to come off of GLA it would require extensive changes to the base class skills, at which point why not just make a new class in itself? If you have to change more than half of the abilities to make it work well then it should be rethought about. But that's my opinion.

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Theirs works differently though. It cannot be maintained indefinitely and it doesn't give a flat boost but rather a % of the users SkS/SpS. While your spell works similarly to theirs, I see no restriction. If Time Mage gets a single target version it will need to have restrictions imposed to prevent its broken usage that we saw in FFXI. RDM was really only a debuffer/buffer in XI and FFTA/2. Every other instance it was a melee with primarily attacking and healing magic getting only a portion of those available to BLM/WHM.

Edit: I should clarify that Yoshi doesn't like the dependance on Haste and the strong focus/requirement it has in XI.

RDM is the one and only FFI class that isn't present in the game (aside from Ninja, and it's a lot more iconic to the series than Ninja is)

Thief. Thief advanced into Ninja.

[Gamemako]

Actually RDM as a core job itself doesn't really work well in a MMO setting...

That's really going to depend on how you're defining the Red Mage archetype. Red Mage in FF12i wielded the most powerful fire spell (Ardor) and could carry a either a greatsword with heavy armor or a mace and robes. FFTA/2 was 3 direct attacks (fire/ice/lightning), 1 cure, 1 buff, 1 DoT, and 1 debuff, and was still defined mostly by the Doublecast ability. If you want the Red Mage in the FF1 sense -- all magics and melee -- then yes, it's a meaningless addition. That Red Mage existed because there was a limit on the number of characters you could bring. However, the Red Mage as a mixture of magic spells and melee in general is not a problem to execute. "Support" abilities are necessarily a part of all classes already, so like I said, the only place you'll run into trouble with Red Mage is healing spells.

Haste, refresh, phalanx, Enthunder, Enfire, Enaero, Enstone, (etc), Debuffs and Enhancements, etc etc etc.

RDM would be the perfect idea to actually introduce SUPPORT as a role for the DF. you can literally do anything as an RDM, so give us that option. The biggest roadblock from RDMs being true RDMs in FFXIV is the DF.

*takes deep breath*

None of those associated with Red Mage in any game except FF11, and FF11 was total shit in every possible way.

There will never be a pure support subcategory in ARR. The rule with support is that you can never take it back. Support jobs become essential for content. Every endgame run right now effectively requires BRD, the only semi-support job. The more narrowly-focused you make the support job, the more essential it becomes at endgame and useless it becomes otherwise. Not only that, you can't even make a support job in ARR at this time because you have 5 abilities to do it in. A class cannot be support-focused because it fails to be capable in solo and leveling content. Support jobs are also fundamentally boring as all hell to play. If BRD were pure support, the player would hit a song and then run in circles for 10 minutes while the rest of the team team battles Twintania. That just doesn't work.

The RDM would have to be either so good at everything, that he could fill all roles (healer/tank/dd) as well as a focused job in this area in order to fit into the 4-character-party, OR he has to be made into *either* DD *or* healer *or* tank.

Red Mage is not a tank or healer (lol @ FF11, though). It's pretty clear to me where it lies within the trinity. The secondary job would have to be a tank (e.g. Mystic Knight) or a healer (something off-the-wall here, since there are no stabby healers about in FF).

//EDIT: Mechanically, either second job role would work. Healer would give you a reason to have a healing spell or two on the class, making it feel more like a Red Mage once you've committed to that DPS role. However, a healer job from hybrid melee class might be a bit tough to implement and doesn't really have a clear starting point. A tank job has a great starting point in Mystic Knight, but lacks any reason to have healing on the class.

RDM is the one and only FFI class that isn't present in the game (aside from Ninja, and it's a lot more iconic to the series than Ninja is)

Umm, thief is also ostensibly missing. You have Fighter/Warrior, White and Black Mages, and Blackbelt/Monk represented. The only upgrade job represented is Knight/Paladin, which (like Ninja) has evolved into a different sort of job in its own right.

[jomoru]

Unsure how it would be balanced (as I stated earlier) while still maintaining the flavor of the class (they butchered SMN's flavor, after all).

But I add my voice to the throng; RDM plox. Maybe something along the lines of a Magic Knight with Doublecast for cross-class skills or something, idfk.



RDM is the one and only FFI class that isn't present in the game (aside from Ninja, and it's a lot more iconic to the series than Ninja is)

Thief is pretty iconic