SMN - Why it is not a very interesting job and not a good upgrade from ACN

[pandabearcat]

Actually, not having contagion makes us lose ~4 GCDs every 3 minutes. It is a bit more than that, but because of the way I rounded in my analysis it comes to between 4 and 5 GCDs lost.

Since those would be used solely for ruin, you lose 320-400 potency (a bit less because miasma and thunder have hit damage).

While the pet provides ~5500 potency total, so a 10% increase would be better than having garuda up.

You also lose the extra 15 sec over RS, which means you lose 145*5*0.2...or 145 potency from DoTs over RS.

So if it is 10% more damage, it will eek out a win to use Ifrit (if it worked correctly).

Contagion is so much more fun though, I hate bio and how short it is.

Of course, on cleave fights, longer AoE fights where contagion bane is useful, and on any fight with lots of boss movement, Ifrit loses by default.

[Kevee]

Actually, not having contagion makes us lose ~4 GCDs every 3 minutes.

Don't you mean every minute?


Also parsing now, Ifrit on SIC is more DPS. It's hovering around 62 DPS.

[pandabearcat]

Don't you mean every minute?

Hmm, no, its over 3 minutes, so that is 2 contagions.

On my previous thingy it rounded out to be:

Bio2 has 30 seconds of uptime per cast, with an additional 30 seconds from 2 contagions, so we need to cast it 5 times. Without contagion, 6 times.
Miasma has 24 seconds of uptime, with 30 seconds from 2 contagions, so we cast it 6.25, or 7 times. Without contagion, 7.5 times, or 8 times.
Bio has 18 seconds of uptime, so we cast it 8.3 or 9 times. Without contagion, 10 times.
Thunder also has 18 seconds, so we cast it 9 times. Without contagion, 10 times.
Sflare has 30 second uptime, so we cast it 6 times. No Change
Miasma 2 we cast twice, during contagion. We no longer use Miasma II, instead Ruin II twice, which amounts to a loss of 40 potency over 3 min.

So w/o contagion we only lose 4 GCDs in the way I rounded up before. Without rounding, it comes out to 1+1.25+~3.33, or 5.5 GCDs.

Without rounding, you lose ~446 potency due to missed Ruins, and 40 more for losing miasma, makes it out to ~486 potency.

Is that better or worse than ifrit vs garuda? Might be worth checking out.

EDIT: oh, also because of missed 145 potency from lack of RS uptime, you instead come out at ~631 potency loss.

EDIT2: That means that contagion is ~3.8% personal dps increase, not counting pet damage.

EDIT3: I forgot to mention, that one of the huge benefits of Contagion is the amount of mana you save.

Putting up a full rack of DoTs costs nearly 800 or so mana, and 4 Ruins is less than half of that. This is a significant issue when you don't have a bard.

[Kevee]

Yeah, I honestly had a brain fart.
"Derp, Contagion gives us 5 GCDs per use!"
Contagion does give us extra time, but it just(for the most part) displaces our Ruin casts. As you're saying, it's actually a minor GCD gain over 3 minutes.

Hmm, no, its over 3 minutes, so that is 2 contagions.

Ruin II instead of Miasma II would be an 80 potency loss. 160 vs 240.

[pandabearcat]

I thought Miasma II was 20 initial + 10 per tick.

25 seconds total is 8 ticks (well, maybe 9 I suppose, but 8 guaranteed ticks), which is 20 + 80 per, right? So you lose 20 per ruin.

Hrm, there are a few more things I forgot.

Since you have to refresh thunder and bio within RS, you instead lose 20% additional for those two displaced Ruins, so you lose 32 more potency.

However miasma and thunder have cast potencies, and you gain 30*1.666 + 20*1.25 = 75 potency.

So you lost actually 43 less than I assumed, so you lost about 588 potency.

Based on eyeballing calculations, this is slightly more than 10% of garuda's dps.

[Kevee]

I thought Miasma II was 20 initial + 10 per tick.

25 seconds total is 8 ticks (well, maybe 9 I suppose, but 8 guaranteed ticks), which is 20 + 80 per, right? So you lose 20 per ruin.

Hrm, there are a few more things I forgot.

Since you have to refresh thunder and bio within RS, you instead lose 20% additional for those two displaced Ruins, so you lose 32 more potency.

However miasma and thunder have cast potencies, and you gain 30*1.666 + 20*1.25 = 75 potency.

So you lost actually 43 less than I assumed, so you lost about 588 potency.

Based on eyeballing calculations, this is slightly more than 10% of garuda's dps.

20 Initial, 10 per tick. 15s. + 15s from Contagion.

So 70 + 50 from Contagion. 120 per Miasma II cast.

[pandabearcat]

Isn't Miasma II only 10 seconds long? So while Contagion adds 5 ticks (50 potency) the original miasma II only does 20 + 30 (3 ticks in 10 seconds).

[Kevee]

Isn't Miasma II only 10 seconds long? So while Contagion adds 5 ticks (50 potency) the original miasma II only does 20 + 30 (3 ticks in 10 seconds).

No, it's 15.

[pandabearcat]

No, it's 15.

Oh okay, all the sites say 10. Was too lazy to check ingame.

And so adding in another 40 potency lost basically means the initial number is correct.

Either way I never use miasma II (mostly just to spite you, Kevee).

[Kevee]

Oh okay, all the sites say 10. Was too lazy to check ingame.

And so adding in another 40 potency lost basically means the initial number is correct.

Either way I never use miasma II (mostly just to spite you, Kevee).

http://xivdb.com/?skill/177/Miasma-II