Yoshi P talks about Warriors- from Producer Letter Live @ TGS

[Tronic]

Any WAR that takes Flash is wasting an additional slot. A WAR gets to use Flash all of 3 times without the advantage of the Blind debuff before running out of MP and it takes twice as long to get the mana for Flash back, thanks to WARs having half of the mp of a PLD. Bringing up Flash for a WAR in a discussion of AoE threat demonstrates that you have no clue what is actually useful for a WAR.

I'll disagree here - I find it useful on fights leading up to bosses as a way to conserve TP by using it instead of more overpowers to get agro; this in turn lets me chain pull faster. Not to mention it is situationally convenient whenever it happens that you have mobs not lined up so that overpower hits them all, and don't want to waste that extra second or two repositioning.

Furthermore, despite not being really necessary but merely convenient, I can't really see any other skill being more desireable. Assuming you start with Convalescence, Provoke, Featherfoot and Internal Release, what's better than Flash for your fifth slot? Savage blade is as useful as Steel Cyclone. Awareness nullifies crits over 25 seconds... assuming a mob has a 5% base crit chance, that's a whopping 2.5% mitigation over 25 seconds... meh. It might prove useful in a token encounter down the line which has high crit rate, but not for now. Second wind is so laughable I have to strain looking at my health bar to see it move when I use it. Haymaker sounds great on paper, but alas, most (all?) bosses are inmune to it. And if I'm going to choose a skill that is only useful on trash, I'd rather have flash, which is situationally convenient, rather than Haymaker which will mitigate damage I really don't need mitigated. And mantra, untraited, boosts party healing by 5%... I don't consider it enough to be worth it. I have heard somewhere it might be 10%, but I can't get a clear report with a date on it. If that were the case, then it'd be much better... but still, leveling monk up to 42... >.<

[CurlyBruce]

...

His data points were extrapolated because it's asinine to test crit rate at literally every value possible (341>342>343) He picked his plateaus and noticed it had a linear correlation which was corroborated by another persons separate test. He admits that his formula is most assuredly not the real formula but for what we need it works. The reason Hiir is parsing a different crit rate is simply due to margin of error in his sample size. He probably was parsing different Garudas or w/e encounters and didn't actually sit at a Training Dummy for 1000-2000 hits which is what you need to have an acceptable though not ideal margin of error in your results. Parsing my own results at a training dummy now coming up to 600+ hits and my crit rate within the predicted % from what Valk's calculator says it would be. Incidentally, it is also correctly calculating what my average auto-attack is with my current STR and DTR, so food for thought.

[Kalamari]

Couldn't imagine tanking without Flash as WAR.. As was said unlike Overpower with long wind-up time Flash is instant and covers a very convenient 360 degree radius instead of a cone, much more reliable for picking up moving targets too. It's the only tool in our arsenal that lets build high enmity on targets without breaking Sleep. Also gives you something to do when Berserk wears off, I usually double Flash as filler during the debuff.

[Leiron]

CoS hits harder than overpower, and it covers a larger area.

[Kitru]

Furthermore, despite not being really necessary but merely convenient, I can't really see any other skill being more desireable. Assuming you start with Convalescence, Provoke, Featherfoot and Internal Release, what's better than Flash for your fifth slot?

You'd be surprised at how useful Awareness is. The crit rate for NPCs is actually a fair deal higher than 5% (I think it's closer to 10-15%, but I could be wrong), but you don't use Awareness when you need to take less damage; you use it when you need to keep damage predictable. There are some attacks that go straight through CDs and are followed up by a cluster of melee attacks. Awareness lets you control the maximum amount of damage that you take for that time frame. Awareness isn't a tank CD in the traditional sense, which is where people go wrong with it.

I also don't see much use in Provoke. The only time I've ever had it be useful is when I'm MT, I die, and then get a rez. Of course, 99% of the time, when the MT dies, it's a wipe. Either that or the OT is capable of bouncing in and taking over as MT without any problems. At any other time, Provoke is so ludicrously worthless that I don't even remember that it's on my bar at the time. It just doesn't generate a useable amount of threat in any other situation.

Currently, my loadout is Convalescence, Awareness, Featherfoot, Second Wind, and Provoke. Second Wind and Provoke are only on there because I haven't bothered leveling PUG up high enough to get Internal Release and Mantra. As soon as I do, I plan on getting rid of Provoke first.

The issue with Flash, as I see it, is, and always will be, the fact that its so very limited in the number of uses you get out of it. You get 3 uses before you run out and then you have to wait minutes to get enough back to use it once more and a single Flash isn't going to be even remotely useful. AoEs only do their job when you used them repeatedly. I tried using Flash for a while, but it just wasn't useful. There really wasn't any point in keeping it.

[Leiron]

That is because provoke isn't a threat generator, its supposed to be a taunt.
Its the only taunt as well, and in the event there is a fght requiring tank swaps, you would need it.

[Kitru]

Its the only taunt as well, and in the event there is a fght requiring tank swaps, you would need it.

And if/when they do add a fight that requires a tank swap, Provoke will be required for that fight, likely at the cost of Awareness (if there is a lot of AoE damage) or Mantra (if there isn't), but, until then, it doesn't really serve a purpose because there aren't any situations where you really Provoke is actually useful. It just sits there, taking up a spot, waiting for an extreme contingency to occur. Second Wind is more useful than that, as I see it, because you can at least *know* that you'll need a self heal at some point.

[Stonie]

i am a WAR here that spams self heals and attack and def buffs alot and i'll say this. my defencive macro i have set up with thrill of the battle second wind foresight and convalescence, i do this in tight spots preferably with wrath 5 up for extra heal crits, the self heals together normally get me for about 1500 and with the defence and amped heals it gets me out of really bad places when needed, my offencive macro i have set up with blood bath, unchained, internal release, maim and berserk. this gives me about a 95% damage increase as well as a 20% crit increase for my leeches, i'm only 48 so i havn't got to test this on the high end content but so far i have really been liking it, also taking Garuda with both dps dead on the second phase and only a healer made me feel pretty badass. leeches help with groups alot from bloodbath cuz bloodbath and the 95% increase and overpower spams are no joke when it comes to leaching. War is just better at managing groups i feel. If any one plays exactly like this and still thinks it sucks on high end stuff let me know why cuz i feel this is about the best way to play it.

[Rios-Drakoon]

i am a WAR here that spams self heals and attack and def buffs alot and i'll say this. my defencive macro i have set up with thrill of the battle second wind foresight and convalescence, i do this in tight spots preferably with wrath 5 up for extra heal crits, the self heals together normally get me for about 1500 and with the defence and amped heals it gets me out of really bad places when needed, my offencive macro i have set up with blood bath, unchained, internal release, maim and berserk. this gives me about a 95% damage increase as well as a 20% crit increase for my leeches, i'm only 48 so i havn't got to test this on the high end content but so far i have really been liking it, also taking Garuda with both dps dead on the second phase and only a healer made me feel pretty badass. leeches help with groups alot from bloodbath cuz bloodbath and the 95% increase and overpower spams are no joke when it comes to leaching. War is just better at managing groups i feel. If any one plays
exactly like this and still thinks it sucks on high end stuff let me know why cuz i feel this is about the best way to play it.

Trust me, WAR is a good Tank for lvling and also for 50 Dungeons like Amdapor Keep and Palace, also for Ifrit HM, but beyond that, Paladin is alot stronger.

If you have the Equip and go Titan HM, you will see, Titan Hugs you for 1000-2500 normalo and sometimes with 4500, you dont have a selfheal to conter that.
Paladin has alot Defensive Abilities, and thats good.

We have Bloodbath wich heals us for 40-100 per Hit, or StormsPath for 100-150 (all 9sec, but you also Need to build aggro and StormsPath is not in the aggro Combo)
And we have our "mighty" InnerBEast, taht heals us about 800, if we use alot CDs like Berserk, Convalcence, Malm buff on us, debuff on Boss, we can get 1500-2000 Selfheal, but Berserk has 90sec CD Conva. has 120sec CD.
You dont have the abilities to conter Incoming dmg, thats why Groups Prefer Paladin as Tank, because ist easier to heal him then a Warrior thats a fact.
If SE would buff our Bloodbath, StormsPath and IB, and Change it from " % dmg done" to "%max HP" maybe then we will be better then now.
Trust me, a Healer dont feel if you have Bloodbath on you or not, or selfheal from StormsPath, but a heale feel the 20%/40%/100% dmg reduce from Paladin, and also his 60% blockchance (Block = 20-24% dmg reduce)

Right now, Warrior is just a Second Class Warrior, good for Dungeons and Ifrit HM, but beyond that, Paladin is better.

[Stonie]

Actually they're tanking the boss and doing it significantly better than Warriors. They're off tanking and doing it significantly better than Warriors. There's absolutely nothing Warriors do better. When something like this happens, it's not called having "strengths and weaknesses." It's called "imbalance."



Said the guy who hasn't actually played the game to find out. I'm sure in an ideal world where you have absolute faith in the game being perfectly balanced, this is true. For example, in your head.






No, they can't, because warriors only have the mana to use flash 3 times.



Until the mobs die. Not that you'd know considering you haven't PLAYED THE GAME.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSJV2519AxE
Two warriors here on Titan hard mode, one main tanking and one dpsing. am i missing something here?