YOSHI FIX THE DANG GIL ISSUE THAT IS KILLING OUR PLAYERS!!!

[Phogg]

I have all of my crafts except cooking at 40 and above. My husband has cooking around 40 something, and mining and botany at 50. Your argument is invalid.

We did it this way on purpose. I enjoy crafting, he enjoys gathering, and we both enjoy being self sufficient. However, both of us have noticed that if you level only DoW/DoM (as anyone is free to do, again, crafting is a SIDE CLASS) you have a serious gil insufficiency. We leveled this way on purpose, but we also both feel that crafting/gathering should not be necessary. The devs agree with that, otherwise DoH/DoL would be able to progress you through the storyline. When it's more gil efficient for me to just craft new gear rather than pay to repair it, there's a problem. Obviously, again, the devs agree with that or they wouldn't have lowered the price of repairs/dark matter.

Like I said, you don't need to level any of what you consider a "side class" to make gil off the people who do, so where is the problem outside of laziness for those people that cannot figure out how to accomplish something so simple? Seeing as you do craft, you then know how easy it is. You should also know no one needs to feel compelled to level those classes. Farm materials! Even in FFXI if you did not want to craft the best ways to make gil were to farm materials for those that do, its not something new to MMOs. In fact, its fairly ridiculous to demand you should get everything you need just spamming your dungeons for gear. Why even have an economy or crafting jobs at all then?

Also, I think the change in repair costs has more to do with the fact that they took dark matter off the list of gathering items and left repair costs to high otherwise. If they left dark matter as something that can be gathered, people would still complain that they don't want to talk to someone other then an NPC to repair their gear.

It doesn't even matter, even before the changes to repair costs, if you do it right and do not simply spam dungeon after dungeon, you will have ample gil for repairs. At some point, especially in an MMO, the players need to figure out how to make money whether it be through mobs dropping gil or some other way, its part of the game, and despite the crying it works. Change much more, with the rate of new gil you can make from Leves right now, and good luck with that skyrocketing inflation.

@CianaIezuborn

Hope you can see this here apparently I can only respond 4 times a day? lol

Anyway, I agree with your last point about crafting leve returns possibly being too high in the long term. If I can generate 35k a day from that alone of new gil, that is alarming. But the point is made to make it clear people who suggest there is not enough new gil coming into the economy is patently false.

Also, yes I dont think you should be able to grind dungeons and break even as a battle class, that will just stifle the economy and make crafting/gathering pointless given that the entire purpose of dungeons is to get new gear. You don't need to farm for hours. I know one thing anyone can farm easily for 20 minutes and make 15-20k. That should get you what, 4 complete repairs and 15 or so dungeon runs? That's really not much to ask.

The big concern is if crafting can generate so much new gil, then adding new ways for battle classes to bring in even MORE gil will be terrible in the long run. Like I said, personally I would like it to stay as it is because gil SHOULD be a direct reward to gathering and crafting classes. It enables us to purchase materials from battles classes that farm materials, its a running partnership. Its just that one side of that partnership is acting very lazy about the matter.

As for repairs in XI, no there were not repairs. But you also did not make enough money from partying alone to support yourself and acquire new gear along the way (pre-75, economy was pretty broken after they lifted the level cap to 99). Quests gave no significant amount of gil at all, lucky to get 200 gil from those.

Also for clarity partying for XP in XI is just like leveling in this game, and you certainly get enough free gear and quest gil to keep up easily on costs for repairs. This issue is about people expecting to do nothing but grind dungeons and have everything handed to them with no extra effort. That's just ridiculous in an MMO with a player economy.

[eeto]

guildhest - leves - limited to 4 and 3 every 12 hours - not so great
FATE - no one does those for gil
dungeons - at 50 the repair bills are stupid so you end up losing (I hear it all the time from the FC mates)
quests - will end as will the gil from them
NPC - as a whole they take more than they give

I was actually attempting to show in an extremely simple manner that "play the AH" and "crafting" is not one of them.

Also NPC meant - NPCing mats. The note there should be - they give you less than peanuts' worth.

[Moirweyn]

I was actually attempting to show in an extremely simple manner that "play the AH" and "crafting" is not one of them.

Also NPC meant - NPCing mats. The note there should be - they give you less than peanuts' worth.

I got that but, many people are missing the entire point of the topic. They may have taken it the wrong way so I kinda broke out the frying pan.

[CianaIezuborn]

...

Like I said, you don't need to level any of what you consider a "side class" to make gil off the people who do, so where is the problem outside of laziness for those people that cannot figure out how to accomplish something so simple? Seeing as you do craft, you then know how easy it is. You should also know no one needs to feel compelled to level those classes. Farm materials!
I don't consider it lazy to not want to spend hours farming mobs to gain materials to sell to crafters to pay for gear repairs so that I can eventually run a dungeon. If I want to be rich and get the best luxuries in the game, yeah I'll have to do that. But simply to be able to continue to participate in the activities that the game trained me to do in my combat class and rewarded me for doing all the way up to 50? For 50 levels you didn't need to worry about farming, you could be merry and run dungeons and not worry about a gather node or a crafting class if you didn't want to. But now that you're 50 you better go get a job cause your lazy and a drain on us hard working folk cause you're a big boy now! You can't just do the things you enjoyed before, you've got responsibilities. You think this is a game?

Yeah.

Even in FFXI if you did not want to craft the best ways to make gil were to farm materials for those that do, its not something new to MMOs.
I never had to farm to continue to go out and party in a group in FFXI. I'm fairly certain there weren't repair costs in that game at all. Also I got crystals to sell to the crafters simply from getting my nation buff up and going out and doing combat activities. But whatever no repair cost.

In fact, its fairly ridiculous to demand you should get everything you need just spamming your dungeons for gear. Why even have an economy or crafting jobs at all then?
I haven't seen a single person demand everything they need simply from spamming dungeons. All I've seen is concerns that the cost of participation in combat is greater than the reward from that combat. The big bad DoW classes aren't gonna break into town and steal your jobs with their repaired gear.

Also, I think the change in repair costs has more to do with the fact that they took dark matter off the list of gathering items and left repair costs to high otherwise. If they left dark matter as something that can be gathered, people would still complain that they don't want to talk to someone other then an NPC to repair their gear.
I don't know why they adjusted it. If I wanted to guess, I'd say it's because people were going broke repairing gear. But yeah it could be because you can't gather dark matter anymore.

It doesn't even matter, even before the changes to repair costs, if you do it right and do not simply spam dungeon after dungeon, you will have ample gil for repairs. At some point, especially in an MMO, the players need to figure out how to make money whether it be through mobs dropping gil or some other way, its part of the game, and despite the crying it works. Change much more, with the rate of new gil you can make from Leves right now, and good luck with that skyrocketing inflation.
So essentially, crafters bring so much money into the economy that if we let the dungeon runners break EVEN on repair costs to gil recieved running the dungeons inflation is going to skyrocket?

Lets think about this for a second, who's causing the inflation.

Guy who runs up a 10k gil repair bill over the week, and spends the 10k he made in the dungeon repairing on the mender.

Guy who crafts leves for the week and makes 300k with a 500 gil repair cost.

Sounds like the solution to preventing inflation is dropping gil gained by crafting leves.