You think you are "Hardcore/Elite"?

[ShivaTairo]

I always laugh at the random DF elitist in my party who die when they think they're all pro. They talk all big at beginning of the quest then become silent when their body is laying on the ground.

I also have one friend who t-bags that specific player until the healer raises him/her to make that player more agitated.

Litterally just had this happen on a castrum run, war was talking all kinds of crap to the drgs and in general (Really no reason either just a douche) . I stayed quiet til he started claiming war is all this war is all that and argued with the party, still quiet....

Then he says over every single thing pld can do and I say, (in full dark light tanking a boss), is that so lol, tank this bitch >>>> Leaves duty. Only words i typed that instance, was about on the end lol

[FrogDog]

You can give all the advice you want, not everybody is willing to absorb it and bad players often stay bad.

[ryuhikari550]

I wouldn't consider myself pro but I like to think that I'm fairly good, I will explain fights to people and stick around but there are times where you explain the fight and no one listens and everyone dies the same way. That's when I get frustrated I don't leave unless everyone is absolutely terrible (which I've done about 3 times). I even stayed to explain the Garuda fight to someone even after our healer left (I was level 50 helping a FC mate) and couldn't replenish the party because it was a Trial.

I once had a tank tell me I was a bad DD even though I was the last person alive. He bitched because I couldn't kill a mob that was chasing the healer who was running around like a chicken with it's head cut off... I then did the same instance with a group and they told me I was amazing and wish the could farm AK with me but they were all on another server.

Being "pro" has nothing to do with anything, sometimes people are just assholes.

[ZakarnRosewood]

You can give all the advice you want, not everybody is willing to absorb it and bad players often stay bad.

Hurray for self fulfilling prophecies!

[Riko_113]

They are hardcore. Not just anyone can afford not to have a job or a life and play all day, but some people are just better than that.

This made me LoL in my office. Thank you.

I'm medium-hardcore. I love a challenge, progression, and play often , but I also hate stress so I understand at the end of the day it's just a game. I perfect what I do but not by making other players feel bad. I like to be good at what I do IN SPITE OF bad or new players.

[FrogDog]

Hurray for self fulfilling prophecies!

I'll give you an example. Last week in Brayflox...

Tank can't keep aggro on a single target, let alone multiple. Since I've played GLA the problem is readily apparent - he doesn't use flash, and he doesn't use the savage > rage combo, instead he just uses the riot blade combo. I wonder how he's made it this far by basically doing everything wrong but I do the nice thing and give him advice like you suggest; no response, and no change.

Whatever, I can CC. Oh wait, the BLM spams Fire II. Whatever, I can heal it.

We get to the last boss and tank, in caveman speak, informs us to stay out of poison. Ok, so he must know this fight at least, right? Wrong. He eats every poison breath and keeps the boss in poison. No matter how much say to move the boss and that it's healing from the poison it makes no difference. Eventually all the healing I'm having to do makes me pull threat so I use the opportunity to move the boss. We wipe anyway because the boss is interrupting my casts and the fight has been going on for awhile.

Second attempt I try to make the point again about the threat combo and moving the boss out of poison. Silence. Tank pulls. We get a little further because boss spits puddles on the ranged DPS for awhile but as soon as he spits on tank it's just like before.

Third attempt I'm losing my patience at this point and repeat what I've said again while adding that I shouldn't be pulling threat and that I'd leave if we didn't get it down this time. Fight goes basically the same way except a DPS pulls aggro before I do and dies from a breath. I die next from boss hitting me and interrupting casts. Tank finally dies but SMN manages to finish the fight.

Tank then said "good group". I snapped and told him he was terrible. Since patience and advice didn't work, I thought maybe honesty would. At least I got a response this time. "lol noob u stand in poson"

This was probably my worst experience with a person in DF so far but it wasn't unique.

[ZakarnRosewood]

I'll give you an example. Last week in Brayflox...

Tank can't keep aggro on a single target, let alone multiple. Since I've played GLA the problem is readily apparent - he doesn't use flash, and he doesn't use the savage > rage combo, instead he just uses the riot blade combo. I wonder how he's made it this far by basically doing everything wrong but I do the nice thing and give him advice like you suggest; no response, and no change.

Whatever, I can CC. Oh wait, the BLM spams Fire II. Whatever, I can heal it.

We get to the last boss and tank, in caveman speak, informs us to stay out of poison. Ok, so he must know this fight at least, right? Wrong. He eats every poison breath and keeps the boss in poison. No matter how much say to move the boss and that it's healing from the poison it makes no difference. Eventually all the healing I'm having to do makes me pull threat so I use the opportunity to move the boss. We wipe anyway because the boss is interrupting my casts and the fight has been going on for awhile.

Second attempt I try to make the point again about the threat combo and moving the boss out of poison. Silence. Tank pulls. We get a little further because boss spits puddles on the ranged DPS for awhile but as soon as he spits on tank it's just like before.

Third attempt I'm losing my patience at this point and repeat what I've said again while adding that I shouldn't be pulling threat and that I'd leave if we didn't get it down this time. Fight goes basically the same way except a DPS pulls aggro before I do and dies from a breath. I die next from boss hitting me and interrupting casts. Tank finally dies but SMN manages to finish the fight.

Tank then said "good group". I snapped and told him he was terrible. Since patience and advice didn't work, I thought maybe honesty would. At least I got a response this time. "lol noob u stand in poson"

This was probably my worst experience with a person in DF so far but it wasn't unique.

I can understand the frustrations when something like this happens, I truly do. That Titan fight I talked about, every time we wiped it was due to the WHM not moving out of the way of the knock back move even after I explained that the only time I lose agro (I was tank) is when he goes to do that move. When you see him turn, start running. Eventually we got the hang of it and won. Getting something like that took almost the entire dungeon timer for a single, repeating boss fight. Doing a full dungeon, you don't have the luxury of repeating a section until everyone gets it down pat. Also, using the DF, its not like you can really mentor them after the fact. You have the one chance encounter with them to try and get it worked out.

Also I also understand that sometimes when you are offering advise, the receiver of that information might misinterpret it as an attack or an insult. Subtleties are lost in text.

There are a few things we need to keep in mind:
- Yoshi-P has designed this game to be welcoming to people who may have never toughed an MMORPG, ergo some things that are obvious to us may be lost on others.
- This game is also on the PS3 and not everyone will have a keyboard and be able to type leading to "caveman speak" in order to get the point across before its too late.
- There will be asshats that play the game and do these things on purpose, good trolls may be hard to differentiate from someone truly struggling.
- As much as you might want to unload a string of frustrations on them, it will not help. There is another human being on the other end of the screen, (except for bots or RMT's, they arent human.)

Personally I want to help foster the next generation of MMO players, not discourage them. If all they run into are people calling them down or ripping into them, then they will quit and the genre could potentially die away. As I said in the OP, its just a personal point of view and I know not everyone will/has to agree with me. You dont sound like the type of player I was targeting anyway but I wanted to take some points from your post to bring a few other things to light. Thank you and please don't take it as a personal attack.

[rtpsoulx]

They're not Hardcore/Elite. They are just rushers.

Hardcore/Elites now are working on building their characters before hitting endgame after their main storyline because they know there are still things that need to be done before hitting endgame such as getting the money to support endgame run's repair bills, cross-skills that will help make their Job role more effective, and working on their crafts and gathering to provide the supplies and currency for any future endgame stuff and supplies.

This has to be one of the best posts i've ever seen. props man.

[ZakarnRosewood]

This has to be one of the best posts i've ever seen. props man.

I would have to agree.

[Huxer]

I'm not interested in teaching other people. I just want them to study what they're supposed to have studied before they get to the instance....just like I did. Then I actually want them to stay focused until we can again part ways. You want to tell me I'm not doing enough? Sorry buddy, responsibility doesn't scale.