Where is FFXIV headed in terms of sexism?

[Zantetsuken]

Geez, Laiferr, what a way to suck the fun out of something. Sexism and Racism/Homophobia are RL problems, but they stem from our natural programming. Sexism exists because nature makes sex (just like food) an extremely high priority for us and society/religion has made sex a negative thing and therefore it takes something away that we are designed to lust after, that's where video games and movies come in to save the day and give us a visual touch of what nature wants us to focus on. There is no negative in allowing us to see what nature wants us to see. Racism is natural also because humans (like many mammals) are territorial (the fact that we claim to own and name land, and then kill each other over the land is proof of that that) so we naturally only like what is relatable to us, so if someone has any difference, we naturally distrust/dislike that person, which is why society has made rules to force us to like each other (seeing how a kid with anything different in schools get singled out and mocked, because he don't fit in and therefore we don't allow them to fit in.) We are all organic machines with natural programming which we fight to change all the time because it goes against our social standards, which leads me to the anti-gay marriage. People have a problem with it because of religion/nature, since gays go against natural mating since natural reproduction isn't possible within 2 of the same sex. Religion/Society has made marriage into a means towards reproduction, so without that reproduction, many hate the idea of 2 of the same sex calling their companionship a marriage since others are married to make a family. It's all natural and I don't agree with homophobia, since it's a sign that we are much more primitive than we like to admit. We have to get past that in RL for us to actually become the progressive intelligent lifeforms that we think we are now. Truly intelligent lifeforms do not kill each other under ANY circumstances, they discuss and compromise, which is NOT natural for humans, our natural instinct is to kill what we don't like. Think of it this way, you see a spider on your wall, what do you do? Most will kill it, because we don't like it and we are territorial, so we take a life for absolutely no reason what-so-ever, does that sounds highly intelligent to you? So to summerize, we NEED sexism in video games/movies, it partially takes care of a natural urge that society won't let us enjoy. As for racism/homophobia, I think those produce extreme negatives, so those have to go, but sexism hurts no one because it doesn't seep from a video game into RL like racism/homophobia would. Men enjoy feminine bodies that show it off, in the USA women barely wear makeup, are out of shape and dress horribly, so we don't get to enjoy what we see in RL too much. It gives us a little smile when we see these things in a game/movie, why take that away? Women don't have to restrain as much as men and they aren't ruled by sexuality like men are, so it's very hard to a female to truly understand what their "taking sexuality away" does to men. So please, stop, we don't try to take away natural things like breastfeeding and emotional breakdowns during your monthly mess, so please stop trying to take away what men consider to be important natural things in every single aspect of our lives, you've already taken it away in RL, leave our "fantasy" sexual needs alone.

This logical argument was written by a male with a female correcting what I wrote and she added quiet a few points, so we did this working together, although it was written from a male perspective.

Rips on religion for suppressing natural drives.

Then tells us to suppress natural drives.

[AdvancedWind]

Rips on religion for suppressing natural drives.

Then tells us to suppress natural drives.

Wow, did you read it? I just saw a wall of text with no paragraphs or line breaks and decided I wasn't bored enough to power thru it =/

[Ryuko]

Wow, did you read it? I just saw a wall of text with no paragraphs or line breaks and decided I wasn't bored enough to power thru it =/

Yup. That's exactly what happened to me.

PEOPLE -- paragraphs! It's not hard.

[Kibo]

I don't have a problem with those things either, as they're not what I was talking/asking about. Sugarcoating is needlessly making things restrictive/played down for fear of upsetting someone. I'm talking about the overall treatment, portrayal and behaviour towards female avatars, in particular, not being on a par with males. If you mean it isn't sugarcoated in the sense that women are harassed in real life therefore it's fine that they're harassed in-game, too, then fair enough.

Mmyeah I get what you are saying. My stance is as long as it fits the theme of the game, then anything goes. As for the holiday event items, they are based on real life holidays in place to celebrate said holidays and as long as they don't go beyond that I don't see any issue.

Much to my regret, I didn't get to play this game as much as I'd like so I'm not up to speed with the exact designs of the current high-end gear. But from the little of what I've seen, the plate armors cover up every inch of the body and are androgynous in terms of design (WAR, PLD). Don't see why they would drift away from that mentality at this point. At least I hope not. The plausible-looking gear design is a big selling point to me.

As for Miqo'tes, I was under the impression they were suggestive, intimate and sexist by nature. If you actually were to cross a man with a cat, that's probably what you would get. I've had tons of cats. None of them have had any qualms about stroking their entire bodies towards my legs to get their will through, those evil bastards. I hope the males are real bishounen womanizers. Would be the icing on my cake.

As for the developers making sexist jokes and hinting on ulterior moves, I just write it off as guys being guys. It's just such an easy joke to fall back on and pretend you are awkward about it for laughs. ┐(￣ー￣)┌

[Cegiana]

I'm sorry, I just wrote it with my wife on notepad and it doesn't look good like that, I will correct it.

Update, there, I broke it up to make it easier to read...hopefully... lol



>>>Rips on religion for suppressing natural drives.
>>>Then tells us to suppress natural drives.

Yes, we have to be selective in what we suppress, if we give into all our natural urges, we would pee and shit on street corners whenever we have to use the bathroom or kill someone for farting in an elevator. So yes, we have to suppress SOME natural urges, but others that don't have a such negative aspect, we should control but not suppress, especially since it's not healthy to deny yourself everything you like. And another yes to religions suppressing everything we like, that's how religions control people, religions don't have our best interests in mind, they have to maintain their control through fear and restriction, it's how they roll. I'm surprised I had to say that to you, I thought this was common knowledge. lol

We need to control ourselves but not to the point where everything a male enjoys goes away, you think it's bad now, wait 50 or so years. At the current rate of social restriction, comparing changes from 50 years ago to today, if anything offends anyone 50 years from now, it will legally go away...kinda glad I'm most likely gonna be dead by then.

[drivendawn]

This forum has become a politically correct mad house LOL.

[CrystalWeapon]

This is the reason why the colosseum gear looks the same on males and females.

It lets them be sexist while keeping it fair.

[Shougun]

This is the reason why the colosseum gear looks the same on males and females.

It lets them be sexist while keeping it fair.

lol <,< Coliseum gear on males >.>

Fighting in mah stretchy boxers - Mage Coli looks like silk boxers. Best on Roegdryn (sp..)

[Laiferr]

...so please stop trying to take away what men consider to be important natural things in every single aspect of our lives, you've already taken it away in RL, leave our "fantasy" sexual needs alone.

I'm not dismissing most of what you said, I felt like I wasn't really understanding what you were trying to get at/it wasn't overly relevant/didn't really make sense. So forgive me for not addressing all of it. I completely disagree with 'needing' sexism in games. I would also disagree that sexism in game doesn't relate to real life. For some, maybe, but it encourages an attitude. I was also talking about many forms of sexism other than skimpy gear (again, not sure why only this is being focused on).

If you have 'fantasy' sexual needs, by all means, go for it. Not opposed whatsoever. You do know women have sexual needs and urges, too. Why has this become so staunchly male/female? I specifically was talking about 'avatars' - not even necessarily women playing them. We all log on to play a game and have fun. It would be nice to be able to do that and not get treated differently or have the development team impose certain 'inclinations' on us female avatars. I was just wondering if anyone else had experienced this or felt the same way.

And again, I just want to stress this is not a super big deal. Starting a discussion over it doesn't mean it's the end of the earth for me, just wanted to talk about it/see what other thought

[Arcturus]

If you think about it, male avatars in this game are also objectified. In most cases they're exceedingly handsome, well-built specimens, complete with unrealistically fabulous hair. This certainly deviates from the reality of things, where in our world most people, especially males, do not carry the same ideal physique and overall appearance as their Eorzean counterparts.

Look at Raubahn for example, with all that hypermasculinity. I personally won't play a Highlander because I'm uncomfortable looking so overtly badass. So I opted for a more modest midlander. But what about the Midlander from the trailers? A few tumblr posts I've seen concerning this computer generated heartthrob go along the lines of "Have you ever wanted to **** your desktop wallpaper?" and "He is so hot OMFG." This is male objectification, which is constantly in game, despite how normalized it seems.

At the end of the day, I honestly want to say F this thread so bad because there is already too much politicization in real life, and I don't want it creeping up into my entertainment. But it deserves respect and a dignified response because it is a serious subject. In the real world. However, these "objectifications" are concerning our avatars. And avatars are objects we use to represent ourselves. It should be noted that there are some, male and female, who appreciate and take pleasure from being able to play the very same type of "objectified" character you may be uncomfortable with. And the fact that SE is giving us the option to be nearly flat chested or well endowed, tall or short, to wear an outfit that is risqué or garments that are more modest, is good enough for me.

To answer the question, the fact that we are given choice as to how our character looks, in terms of fashion as well as physical appearance, is why this is a non issue for me.