You might as well add an official DPS log to the game...

[Reimmi]

If someone doesn't meet your expectations in your own party you are free to tell them and then kick them, it's your party, then you can just black list them and move on. Who cares?

The problem is, by making dps meters against TOS to talk about, you can't tell someone why they're being kicked, so that person just thinks people are being toxic for no reason, and not knowing why they were kicked, e.g their DPS is lackluster, for a fight that has an enrage

I think a good compromise is only allowing a in game DPS meter against fights with an enrage, and the sky sanctuary thing, that way it'll never come up in casual content

[Runaes]

I think a good compromise is only allowing a in game DPS meter against fights with an enrage, and the sky sanctuary thing, that way it'll never come up in casual content

The one issue with SSS is that it's overworld content. I have seen someone boast that they managed to clear the final savage dummy of that tier, but when watched not only did they barely clear it using food and potions, but their chocobo companion was out.

As for the comment about raiders wanting perfection. We don't want perfection, we want competence. I've seen a wipe at 0.1% where the analysis of one of the party members showed that they one of their gcds was used 5/26 times, which would have easily compensated for that .1% if they had used them even 50% of the time.

Missed buttons, damage downs, these things happen and I don't expect people to be perfect 100% of the time. But if you fundamentally are missing a component of your class and I can't point it out because dps meter illegal, the only thing I can do is kick and banlist.

[TwiceDamned]

The problem is, by making dps meters against TOS to talk about, you can't tell someone why they're being kicked, so that person just thinks people are being toxic for no reason, and not knowing why they were kicked, e.g their DPS is lackluster, for a fight that has an enrage

I think a good compromise is only allowing a in game DPS meter against fights with an enrage, and the sky sanctuary thing, that way it'll never come up in casual content

The kick itself is then illegal, as it is an act of harassment using third-party tools. Your only real alternative under the TOS is to Vote Abandon, disband the party, and try again.

[TwiceDamned]

this guy you're replying too has to be trolling

Nope. I just don't suffer idiots very well.

[theunhappypotato]

Nope. I just don't suffer idiots very well.

if you're really serious. you're funny

[theunhappypotato]

The kick itself is then illegal, as it is an act of harassment using third-party tools. Your only real alternative under the TOS is to Vote Abandon, disband the party, and try again.

nah its totally legit to kick someone out of my own party who holds the party back, not matter what game ff14 included

[Valence]

Your only real alternative under the TOS is to Vote Abandon, disband the party, and try again.

That's usually what they do on JP. The 3 wipes rules, meaning after the third, they silently disband and queue up again, hoping to score a better party of players next time. They don't really try to curate.

[Voidmage]

I think a good compromise is only allowing a in game DPS meter against fights with an enrage, and the sky sanctuary thing, that way it'll never come up in casual content

While such an in-game dps meter would help, you would always have the same problem.
People not only kick because someone is so extremely bad but also those who are either slightly below it (no chance for improvement) or those who's damage is enough but simply not at the number the party leader likes (unfair).
There aren't just "don't know how to press buttons" and "I am a god" players. Most fall in the middle but it's the Tomestone judges who think they are the cream of the cream.
Then you also have the PF loot problem that, if you are unlucky, you can be good but simply didn't get the gear.

There really isn't a compromise, something will always be bad.
If you turn down the DPS checks then you will have the old body check problem as an answer and still have people kicked because more damage means the potential to skip mechanics.
If you turn both down than Savage loses it's difficulty.

No matter what, the whole DPS meter abuse will always be in PF because of a mix of fight design and because people are idiots.

The kick itself is then illegal, as it is an act of harassment using third-party tools. Your only real alternative under the TOS is to Vote Abandon, disband the party, and try again.

If someone kicks without saying anything that's completely legal.
No one is forcrd to play with you on the playground.

@voidmage , no

TwiceDamned is correct.

Read my post again, carefully. If someone kicks you without saying anything that is neither a breach of the TOS, nor in anyway wrong.
Good player conduct has a limit. The kick button is there for a reason. No one is forced to play with you.
But I know that you are only here to rile things up from your other posts so whatever.

[Gurgeh]

@voidmage , no

TwiceDamned is correct.

The kick itself is then illegal, as it is an act of harassment using third-party tools. Your only real alternative under the TOS is to Vote Abandon, disband the party, and try again.

Good player conduct is part of the ToS.

If a party leader kept announcing in chat that they are kicking someone because of the standard of their tombstone.gg profile they would be halled up in GM jail not for having said something but for the circumstances of their kicking of someone who already joined.

If someone kept on doing it ignoring the gms they'd be account suspended.

If they kept returning from suspensoins and kept doing it they'd be account TERMINATED.

...
no one is entitled to a spot in someone else's pf.

Actually, I'd argue that they most certainly are entitled to a spot, if they've posted a *public* PF. If someone doesn't like that they need to either put a static together and use private PFs, or failing that "please pay other games".

* Kick needs to be removed/disabled from 'public' PF all together
* parties can convert private to public but not the other way around
* If you don't like someone your playing with 'you leave'.
* Disband absolutely needs removing from public pf, and an auto-promote adding
* Games need recording back-end so that genuine griefers can be reported, reviewed, and dealt with by SE. If when you've cleared your M4S week 3 you come back to PF just to greif to get your kicks you'll find your self BANNED from the next tier altogether until it's open to unlimited parties.
* (and this is a big one) The PF descriptions need to be made bigger to accommodate roman alphabet languages, so that leaders can be clearer about their expectations. (No doubt that's six years of dev work though)

*Public* PFs need to be recognised as a 'two way' contract. Its not only the party leader making an investment. And the biggest investment is sitting in a boring PF lobby while it fills, only for it to be disbanded six minutes in after the 3rd pull.

[theunhappypotato]

@voidmage , no

TwiceDamned is correct.



Good player conduct is part of the ToS.

If a party leader kept announcing in chat that they are kicking someone because of the standard of their tombstone.gg profile they would be halled up in GM jail not for having said something but for the circumstances of their kicking of someone who already joined.

If someone kept on doing it ignoring the gms they'd be account suspended.

If they kept returning from suspensoins and kept doing it they'd be account TERMINATED.



Actually, I'd argue that they most certainly are entitled to a spot, if they've posted a *public* PF. If someone doesn't like that they need to either put a static together and use private PFs, or failing that "please pay other games".

* Kick needs to be removed/disabled from 'public' PF all together
* parties can convert private to public but not the other way around
* If you don't like someone your playing with 'you leave'.
* Disband absolutely needs removing from public pf, and an auto-promote adding
* Games need recording back-end so that genuine griefers can be reported, reviewed, and dealt with by SE. If when you've cleared your M4S week 3 you come back to PF just to greif to get your kicks you'll find your self BANNED from the next tier altogether until it's open to unlimited parties.
* (and this is a big one) The PF descriptions need to be made bigger to accommodate roman alphabet languages, so that leaders can be clearer about their expectations. (No doubt that's six years of dev work though)

*Public* PFs need to be recognised as a 'two way' contract. Its not only the party leader making an investment. And the biggest investment is sitting in a boring PF lobby while it fills, only for it to be disbanded six minutes in after the 3rd pull.

Magnificent bait sir i must say this is the best i have read so far i thank you for this