Still no auto-combo for 123 on old jobs.

[Canadane]

lol. lmao, even.

Hell, just make it an auto-battler. Why not? Let's just go full 2nd monitor content.

Why stop there? Just have the game play itself and I can log in once every few days to see how it's getting on. Then I can focus on actual games that haven't been run into the ground by droolers yet.

Can't wait for the mobile game.

[Valence]

Its easy to be clueless about your replies considering the last 3 havent made any sense lmao. Its impossible to have a discussion with you when you cant/wont read.

Just read what Shurrikan wrote instead of yapping nonsense. I don't feel like elaborating on what they explained perfectly already. But I do have the feeling that the only argument you manage to scrounge up is always invariably "learn to read"..

[Vintersol]

I would love to see the standard combos on one button. It's just button bloat for the sake of having more buttons.

[BabyYoda]

Well if I work as an artist I will only do art, I will not work as HR,

123 combo is like forcing artist to be an HR for 3 hours a day,

That is like what we have now, 123 exist in almosy all jobs in the same way, it is not a unique combo or anything.

[Asari5]

why not just put the whole rotation on one button? or like on 2-3 to be somewhat flexible. thats possible on several jobs without any problems.

dont come with exaggerating.

is there really so much of a difference between a combo and your rotation? if you mess up any of them you have a dmg loss. and most rotations in this game are very rigid.

less potential to make mistakes too.

[Shurrikhan]

is there really so much of a difference between a combo and your rotation? if you mess up any of them you have a dmg loss.

I would argue that, yes, there is "so much" of a difference.

Though, admittedly, there's little concrete consensus on what a rotation even is, so that will inevitably muddy the question and any answer to it.

Let's just stick with XIV examples for now (though there's plenty to be said for the differences in games with more separable actions).

Bard's "rotation", as it's typically considered, does not distinguish between Burst Arrow and Refulgent. (If it were consistently worth replacing DoTs sooner as not to risk wasting a Hawk's Eye proc, then maybe there'd be some further separation between the two, but as guides stand now, at least, there generally isn't.) They are, in effect, one and the same action, with the greatest-value prepped action always being used. Combos are mostly identical to this. In 99.9% of cases, you will not reopen a combo before finishing it. Apart from Aeolian Edge, you will never use an unprepped combo action.

Compare that, though, against what does actually compose the Bard rotation as distinct and important ordered parts: song order and the duration of each, oGCD sequence to ensure window maximization and minimize drift, gauge spender timings, etc. To me, these feel distinct. I imagine they would to many others, too, though the reasons may vary. Off the top of my head, the remaining parts of "rotation" require more than just tracking the shiny key, unlike the Refulgent Arrow / Shadowbite (or worse, key-swiping Refulgent -> Burst Shot ---activating Refulgent over Burst if both are available--- or Shadowbite -> Ladonsbite so that one needn't pay attention at all).

Or, consider BLM's rotation, and how it, too, may differ from a combo. Though BLM's flexibility was harmed with Dawntrail's addition of Flare Star --which nearly forced something like a combo onto BLM-- its rotation has pretty consistently been highly flexible, able to be varied around movement needs and alignment. Combos are the opposite of that.

That is especially true if said combos lack any surrounding flexible skills that have little to no cost (see ARR Monk and Impulse Drive or ARR/HW Monk and Fracture, or Touch of Death until Stormblood, which allowed --though at opportunity cost-- the Monk to retime the separate skills of their combos; see also Yaten-Enpi on Samurai, especially at its lowest relative net cost).

Heck, take even a job that has no completely fixed combo but still zero reason to use un-prepped skills in 99.9% of cases, as per the Dawntrail-neutered Monk. Rotation, then, is what remains after the forced non-decisions of combos (or, "Monk orb" spenders-when-prepped, "Hawk's Eye" spenders-when-prepped, etc. to the same effect). They are the alterations in Lunar form order (though that too was mostly neutered with the loss of Disciplined Fist), in Blitz order itself, etc.

Yes, both rotations and combos have fail states, but combos' are solely from missing the intended key, while rotations' fail states come from actually getting a decision wrong. They are about as different as missing the target and aiming for (and hitting) something/someone else -- they share a result, yes, but only insofar as one does not care about the decision-making.

less potential to make mistakes too.

Disclosure: I could be misreading some of the context above, as I'm not sure whether "don't come with exaggerating" should mean that others have exaggerated the ease of the game right now (rhetorically minimizing the difference further official access to consolidation would make), the increased ease of play if combos were officially allowed to be consolidated, or just the that ease in excess of what can already be done for any PC player (via plugins), etc.

I think, on the whole, you'll find more people think having less potential to make mistakes is, overall, more a loss than improvement given how little left there is to make mistakes on. But, that still leaves the whole question of what a well-crafted fail-state is and what is, say, a mere unengaging trap (or worse, acts as a net loss to available nuance / deeper forms of difficulty).

For my part, combos are the absolute minimum means of engagement --any other form would be preferable, granting all the same forms of engagement while having room enough for far more-- but are arguably better than absolutely nothing. Barely. And not if at cost to anything else. But still barely better.

_______________

As such, my preferred solution to combos would be to make each combo action separately usable, freeing the available sequences of actions into many more paths and branches varied under a greater number of contexts (as in some 3-5, rather than simply the "more than 0", despite that being the low bar set by virtually all combos in virtually all situations).

Barring that, though, given the prevalence of plugins already allowing consolidation (rendering official access to consolidation mostly just into console-parity) and how often the button-count of combos are used to obfuscate or even excuse most jobs' lack of available decision-making/depth/nuance on the whole, I would not mind if macros were un-neutered such as to allow players to consolidate what they please without additional performance being lost to packet loss, ping, or the inability to queuing their actions (though I would still restrict macros to only one queued action activated per button-press and, special-targeting aside, subject to all the normal constraints of unmacroed GCD actions).

[Garruss]

Please don't give them ideas to put the combo on a brain dead one button thing like pvp has

[Azurarok]

I mean, with the removal of any risks in using most jobs we could most likely just script the entire rotation into one single button and it'd be usable 90+% of the time. The only things holding it back at this point are positionals and casts, and we still have folks asking for those to be removed too. I'm beginning to wonder if some of them are just trying to make it easier to run bots through the game at this point.

[Valence]

Because regurgitating a fully scripted rotation is the epitome of boredom, and that's the crux of the matter for many of us and the whole story of modern XIV. But reducing it without meaningful compensations elsewhere would just dumb it down for the sake of it.
The main problem people have with base combos is that most of them don't even branch anymore, which makes them more hollow than ever, and frankly, they're so ridiculously bland and boring than actually defending that braindead system is mindboggling on its own.

[BabyYoda]

If any of those people play other games they will understand what "combo" means,

Combo should have multiple routs for different purposes,

The problem is that 123 do not have actual game purpose, it is there because the sake of it,

If 123 could lead to different routs that each routs have specific purpose then yes keep it.

Other than that it is useless