Stormblood Scholar could be back in 8.0

[Tunda]

So you don’t like that it forces choice but then you………….also don’t like that both its healing and damage are well balanced amongst the healers despite having this choice

let me clarify this:
let's see this from balance perspective:
1- SGE Pneuma is good.. doing damage and healing at the same time no choice (no balance issue).
2- WHM Afflatus Solace is good.. doing 3 healing to get 1 big attack ( no balance issue)
3- SCH: Having the option between using oGCD damage or oGCD heal could cause the following:

- SCH do higher damage than average healer job.
- SCH do higher healing than average healer job.
- SCH have the illusion of choice that you do damage and gain mana to do healing spell which will cause one of 2 above.

in balance perspective it will not be balance.. that's why SCH is the best healer in the game as graphs are clear on this.
to me I believe on this part more:
- SCH do higher healing than average healer job.

having higher healing than average healer is shown in graphs from other websites sometimes it is higher than 15% of other healers.. which is a balance issue.

and again why we have the "Illusion of choice"? give 3 free stacks of energy drain rather than choosing one of them and giving the "illusion of choice"

[Supersnow845]

let me clarify this:
let's see this from balance perspective:
1- SGE Pneuma is good.. doing damage and healing at the same time no choice (no balance issue).
2- WHM Afflatus Solace is good.. doing 3 healing to get 1 big attack ( no balance issue)
3- SCH: Having the option between using oGCD damage or oGCD heal could cause the following:

- SCH do higher damage than average healer job.
- SCH do higher healing than average healer job.
- SCH have the illusion of choice that you do damage and gain mana to do healing spell which will cause one of 2 above.

in balance perspective it will not be balance.. that's why SCH is the best healer in the game as graphs are clear on this.
to me I believe on this part more:
- SCH do higher healing than average healer job.

having higher healing than average healer is shown in graphs from other websites sometimes it is higher than 15% of other healers.. which is a balance issue.

and again why we have the "Illusion of choice"? give 3 free stacks of energy drain rather than choosing one of them and giving the "illusion of choice"

SGE is first in healing by a pretty wide margin and shield healers already have an inbuilt advantage

Then AST is first in damage

SCH is second in both categories so where is this forced imbalance from energy drain coming from because neither statistic supports it

[Tunda]

SGE is first in healing by a pretty wide margin and shield healers already have an inbuilt advantage

Then AST is first in damage

SCH is second in both categories so where is this forced imbalance from energy drain coming from because neither statistic supports it

I have the stats that shows how much healing all healers do in savage (average) and it is clear that scholar and astrologian are the highest.

I don't have the statistics that shows exactly how much energy drain affect the balance..
but I know for a fact that any game who let player choose between damage and healing as a healer will cause some flaw somewhere..

even if it was an illusion of choice.. why we have illusion of choice in the first place? is it fun to know that you will always use drain and keep your healing up-time like other healers? i don't think so

BTW I don't mind giving the option to heal or damage to a job.. it should have the same option to other jobs too.. but then we have an issue with homonization.. which will increase the hate even more.

I mean.. we learned a lot from cleric stance.. why we repeat it?

[Supersnow845]

I have the stats that shows how much healing all healers do in savage (average) and it is clear that scholar and astrologian are the highest.

I don't have the statistics that shows exactly how much energy drain affect the balance..
but I know for a fact that any game who let player choose between damage and healing as a healer will cause some flaw somewhere..

even if it was an illusion of choice.. why we have illusion of choice in the first place? is it fun to know that you will always use drain and keep your healing up-time like other healers? i don't think so

BTW I don't mind giving the option to heal or damage to a job.. it should have the same option to other jobs too.. but then we have an issue with homonization.. which will increase the hate even more.

I mean.. we learned a lot from cleric stance.. why we repeat it?

Healing



Damage



Example of energy drains maximal contribution on a gold log for Honey Bee lovely

I have no idea where you are getting your data from

[BabyYoda]

Healing



Damage



Example of energy drains maximal contribution on a gold log for Honey Bee lovely

I have no idea where you are getting your data from

Based on data you sent is the following:

1- Scholar healing is higher than average.
2- Scholar DPS is higher than average.
3- Having energy drain is just an illusion of choice as I mentioned in the third point.


In balance prespective even if you try your best to balance healers you couldn't.. because of you try to increase energy drain dps it will broke it.. and if you keep it as it is it will be just an illusion of choice with no meaningful impact... it is just a bad design ability with how it is now

[Connor]

I wonder though. Is Sage above Scholar in healing because it’s just better , or is it because Sage has so many tools that allow it to heal whilst simultaneously dps’ing and thus doesn’t lose the same as a SCH does when healing (i.e Toxicon stacks from shield breaks, Addersgall abilities for MP upkeep, Kardia+Soteria+Krasis, Physis II + Philosophia. If a Scholar was making full use of Aetherflow heals, shields and Emergency Tactics, Dissipation/Seraphism, I wonder if they’d still output the same results (but ofc the SCH would have reduced dps output which is more important).

Also I’m not asking that as a rhetorical ‘ackshually’ question I’m genuinely interested in the answer and don’t know how to analyse it lol

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I wonder though. Is Sage above Scholar in healing because it’s just better , or is it because Sage has so many tools that allow it to heal whilst simultaneously dps’ing and thus doesn’t lose the same as a SCH does when healing (i.e Toxicon stacks from shield breaks, Addersgall abilities for MP upkeep, Kardia+Soteria+Krasis, Physis II + Philosophia. If a Scholar was making full use of Aetherflow heals, shields and Emergency Tactics, Dissipation/Seraphism, I wonder if they’d still output the same results (but ofc the SCH would have reduced dps output which is more important).[...]

If I have to hazard a guess, it's due to some reasons such as:

1. Good amount of SCH's HPS is kept in check by Energy Drain, whereas on SGE if you're about to overcap on Addersgall, every 'maintenance opt' would be to overheal (this is why I wish Kerachole does not have regen component) just to keep your MP healthy.
2. SGE don't quite have the agency over good portions of their overheals like (a)Want to shield/mit with Holos? Oh yeah you can also have this tiny AoE 300p heal lol; (b)How common do we see instances of damage that fully consumes (Pan)Haima stacks? What happens if there are unused stacks? More heals lol.

[Supersnow845]

Based on data you sent is the following:

1- Scholar healing is higher than average.
2- Scholar DPS is higher than average.
3- Having energy drain is just an illusion of choice as I mentioned in the third point.


In balance prespective even if you try your best to balance healers you couldn't.. because of you try to increase energy drain dps it will broke it.. and if you keep it as it is it will be just an illusion of choice with no meaningful impact... it is just a bad design ability with how it is now

I’m responding to the point above that said “I have the data and SCH and AST are doing the most healing” which is blatantly wrong

As for the “illusion of choice” you still haven’t actually explained why that’s a bad thing. At the current DPS balance removing ED doesn’t drop it below SGE using 100% ED doesn’t push it above AST. So ED is entirely about internal balance amongst SCH and its higher than average HPS because it’s a shield healer is kept in check by ED so it doesn’t end up with SGE’s HPS which is excessively high. Please explain why ED is unbalanced in the context of the data I have provided

[Tunda]

I’m responding to the point above that said “I have the data and SCH and AST are doing the most healing” which is blatantly wrong

As for the “illusion of choice” you still haven’t actually explained why that’s a bad thing. At the current DPS balance removing ED doesn’t drop it below SGE using 100% ED doesn’t push it above AST. So ED is entirely about internal balance amongst SCH and its higher than average HPS because it’s a shield healer is kept in check by ED so it doesn’t end up with SGE’s HPS which is excessively high. Please explain why ED is unbalanced in the context of the data I have provided

I think I miss interpreted that information.. as they are better duo healers in general.. they deal high damage and reasonable healing compared to other healer combinations,

Illusion of choice is bad because of ED will never feel impactful and the spell will be always in this state because it will cause a balance issue, the spell will be always in emergency state (consume aether points before aetherflow will be up again)

compare it to any healer damage ability.. not only animation but potency.. ED can never be that while it is as we see now "emergency state"

if you say hey but Scholar damage is ok and HPS is ok why you say this is bad design?

I say look at DRK.. high damage and best shield in the game and still suffering because of bad design job

[Mortex]

I’m responding to the point above that said “I have the data and SCH and AST are doing the most healing” which is blatantly wrong

As for the “illusion of choice” you still haven’t actually explained why that’s a bad thing. At the current DPS balance removing ED doesn’t drop it below SGE using 100% ED doesn’t push it above AST. So ED is entirely about internal balance amongst SCH and its higher than average HPS because it’s a shield healer is kept in check by ED so it doesn’t end up with SGE’s HPS which is excessively high. Please explain why ED is unbalanced in the context of the data I have provided

I would argue that it isn’t unbalanced and more so that if you are the cohealer of a sch that uses all his AF stack for ED then you gonna have a really unfun time. Also if you ever wanna get a really high log as sch you effectively have to screw over your go healer and pump all AF into energy drain letting your co healer do almost all healing and gl finding a healer in PF that takes this kind of abuse.