Dawntrail character graphics update - opinions, requests and discussion megathread

[WeaverOfDreams]

The team did a good job on a lot of graphics but I thought they will make it as close as possible to the old shapes for the facial features. I think that didn't happen here.
I am looking at my character and I can’t help but feel… robbed... I can't currently play.

Race: Miqo’te, Seeker of the Sun, F
Face: 1
Eyes: 4, large iris
Nose: 2
Mouth: 4

1. Cat’s eye slits – Shape
The shape for all Seekers was completely changed.

• In EW, they were thinner at the bottom of the eye and was giving that mysterious, fatal, feral look of a cat.
• In DT, they are plump and taking larger area of the eye.

That is quite a major factor for a change in the expression and I would very much like the old shape back.



https://i.postimg.cc/Wp5Br9Tf/Eyes3.png

2. Cat’s eye slits – Incorrect position and turning
For some reason, the slit is not following the direction of the gaze properly causing the effect of CROSS-EYED! When the face turns, the faraway eye's slit is not following the direction at all.


https://i.postimg.cc/tCY4VnQW/cross2.png

3. Iris size
In DT, the iris size was changed to take a larger area of the eye. This only amplifies the effect of overly big eyes and the cross-eyes feel.

https://i.postimg.cc/qv2088mh/big-eyes.png
https://i.postimg.cc/269fzT5J/big-eyes2.png

4. Upper Eyelid's shadow
It is not casting shadow on the sclera in DT at all. The shadow just merges gradually down and doesn’t look like a cast shadow .
In EW, the dark parts were darker, the light parts were lighter where the eyes are lit by the light. In DT, the eye just stares at you.

https://i.postimg.cc/Hsx9czkz/eyelidshadow2.png

5. Eyelashes
In EW you had those doll-like beautiful curved eyelashes. In DT they are just straight…



6. Lips shape
Lower lip:

• In EW, Mouth 4 had that pretty shape – not too plump, not too big just delicate.
• In DT, they made the lower lip look bigger which made the overall mouth look bigger.

Upper lip:
Looks acceptable on some light but could be better.


https://i.postimg.cc/652GxmQk/lips2.png

7. Nose
Nose looks good enough but still the light makes it a bit bubbly.

[Turnintino]

I had no idea honestly. I'm kind of a solo player I guess? So, there's a lot of things I don't know and I rarely come to the forums for anything. Only reason I had posted today was because this update made me so disgruntled that I felt like I had to make a post to add to the pile of requests for a reversion, or some type of change. But thanks for that info! I'll definitely go and grab that

It's a very new addition (arrived with Dawntrail, in fact), so it's easy to miss if you haven't been paying attention to the press tour or patch notes. But now ya know!

[SaraSin]

First and foremost, I'd like to apologize for my terrible tracing, so some features might look worse than they actually are. I just want to add my alt with a more detailed explanation than my previous post to our voices.

1. The light from our eyes are gone! I think the new lighting makes our eyes look a bit awkward at times and the pupils look bigger now.

2.The lower punctum (? i think thats what it is lol) size has been increased. In my opinion, it kind of gives our characters a more sickly/tired look and puffier eyes.

3.The nose appears a bit larger and more rounded with the nostrils more visible.

4.Cheeks more round and puffy. It's like she ate a mild bee almost.

5. The lips look like have been squished a bit, and the color is changed. Personally not a fan of the larger mouth corners.
I can not recreate the lighting of my old plates no matter how hard I try, and its either my hair or my skin or both that will look dull no matter how much I mess with it. This goes for all of my characters.
Also there's less of our dark eye makeup I'm extremely happy for those who are happy with the changes, some of you guys look fantastic. Some people might call us crazy but with enough small changes to our characters that we've been playing for so long, they do not feel like the same character. It's not all about looking better, it's about too many changes for what we thought was a graphics update that would be minimal to our characters.
Sorry if this was hard to read I'm sleepy ty for your time

[ShinShinShin]

I hate my scales now =( the outline is terrible

[Daralii]

<snip>

This is probably comprehensive enough that it's worth posting on the JP forum as well, though I don't know how well machine translation would convey the specifics.

[Anneliese_Lev]

It is impossible for me to take the exact same picture with the exact same lighting and background for comparison. 7.0 Female Elezen smile is different. Her sharpness is gone. Her expression looks concerned (I used "simper" for both 6.5 and 7.0). It really feels like the developers have altered the animations and facial features so much that they do not look the same anymore, in a bad way. This is so upsetting.

The gaze changes from looking at you to looking somewhere else

[noumen0nn]

Hello, I believe I've identified one of the primary culprits in Hyur Midlanders looking "off", which is that the shading at the top of our eyes cast by our upper eyelids has been significantly toned down, to the point where it looks functionally absent.



I believe this shadow is a critical aspect of Hyur's visual impression. From any distance besides very close up, it creates somewhat of an illusion of the eye being shut slightly, creating a relaxed and confident expression. Without it, Hyur look somewhat wide-eyed, as if maintaining an expression of high alertness or anxiety.



At first, I believed this might be an unavoidable consequence of the new lighting system. However, I then noticed that Viera have kept their similar eye shading into 7.0. If anything, it is very slightly stronger than before.



It should be noted that this shading varied in intensity across different Midlander faces in Endwalker, with face 1 having what I see as the strongest shadow.





I request that this shading be restored, with perhaps some softening at the edge if neccessary to make it seem more in line with the new graphics. Below, I have edited a screenshot of my character's new face in order to more closely mimic this shading, as well as other morph edits to make her facial features match her old face more closely.

[zipkin]

I don't have the energy to add yet more comparison photos to those folks have already shared and shared, especially since the graphics update has been giving me severe eyestrain, but I wanted to still chime in here and say that I am deeply disappointed in the changes made to character designs in a 'texture and shading focused' update. Some of my characters I could learn to tolerate (if I can somehow SEE them again without a headache x.x) but the majority look shockingly different. It's a million tiny things, a chin resized/shaped, a nose altered, the eyes changed in shape/size, lips recolored/shaped/positioned/etc that all add up to a vastly different face shape.

Shape. Not shading. Shape. Different shape. Not texture. Shape.

After seeing the Benchmark I opted against getting the expansion, and right now I'm glad I didn't bother hoping to be pleasantly surprised. Many key character facial elements remain forcibly changed, plenty of examples already in this thread and others. No amount of free Fantasias will bring back options that no longer exist... which means a LOT of peoples' WoLs no longer exist. If the devs want to add new face shapes, new eyes, new brows and jaws and noses, please do ADD them. There are people who like the new facial features, to the point where it has been cited that these are NEW FEATURES even by those enjoying them. Taking away the face elements people have used for years, with no way to get them back, seems callous. The player base was told "Overall appearance of player characters will be altered as little as possible" and that sounds like a lie right now.

[emecsek]

screenshots from endwalker benchmark and 7.0. the only thing i changed on the 7.0 side is the color of the limbal rings to better match the original look.

i also tried recreating an older screenshot, and while not perfect, i think it actually shows better how big the difference is than the screenshots from the character creator.

the most jarring difference is the shape of the mouth. the pupils have also changed in size, making it harder to see the actual color of the eyes. it just doesn't feel like the same character i've grown to love throughout these years.
it feels like au ra got hit especially hard with this graphical update. i just wish they could address these concerns. i've seen many au ra players give their feedback ever since the first benchmark released, but it feels like not much has changed.

[ConantSivrha]

In another post I made in this thread, regarding female miqo'te face 4 mouth 3, I wrote the following:

(...)the mouth itself looks narrower horizontally.

Since then, I have found that the mouth is not, in fact, narrower horizontally.

In the following comparison image, both faces have been turned away from the light, so there is no contrast between shadowed and unshadowed areas. The horizontal width of the lip texture is actually exactly the same, as demonstrated by the blue outline of the Endwalker lip shape over the image of the Dawntrail version of the lips.



The lips in the Endwalker version looked wider to me because the old lighting caused darker shadows to be cast by the lips and by the shape of the face near the lips. This is only a factor when light shines on the face, so it isn't visible in my comparison image, but it can be seen in images like this one from Ysmia, which I also quoted in my other post.

Other than that, in my comparison, you can see more clearly how the top lip shrunk, and how the cupid's bow has been smoothed out. The bottom lip, too, is smaller, but only slightly. The corners of the mouth have also changed, possibly in an attempt to mimic the shadows on the original version.