I would love to see Role Actions replaced

[Equitable_Remedy]

In very broad strokes, you have roughly two choices:

The FF14 approach means that there's a level of homogeneity among classes in a role, but it also means that any combination of classes is viable.

The WoW approach means that there's less homogeneity among classes in a role, but it also means that some classes will underperform or overperform on any given patch/raid/fight.

Both approaches have their tradeoffs.

[Valence]

We've had more heterogeneity in the past and it didn't lock jobs out of content (yes, even PLD in HW). I'm sure there is middleground options between wow and current xiv. Constantly repeating the sutra defending homogenization as a way to flagellate ourselves as if we didn't deserve better because it would be worse is depressing.

[Rithy255]

For foot and leg graze I'd like "additional" Effects

Foot graze for example could cause a small aoe stun on and around the target.
While Leg graze could have a small Reduction effect like 3% that lasts 15s and can be applied around every 60s

Idk I feel like those skills would benefit a lot from additional effects.

[Derio]

If anything we will probably see role actions increase as they introduce more jobs. You already see how job design is getting more and more simplified

[Rithy255]

In very broad strokes, you have roughly two choices:

The FF14 approach means that there's a level of homogeneity among classes in a role, but it also means that any combination of classes is viable.

The WoW approach means that there's less homogeneity among classes in a role, but it also means that some classes will underperform or overperform on any given patch/raid/fight.

Both approaches have their tradeoffs.

One trade off being blandness and the over being imbalance.

Personally I've always been someone who prefer imbalance over blandness but it's not like they could meet us half way like they did with stormblood heck even SHB was way less bland then EW and arguably more balanced.

If you make everything bring the same thing, then in the end all you ever bring a job for is marginally more damage which is the situation that happened with the mid patch, so unironically being so safe with balance and design leads to imbalances because if everything brings the same utility, mobility ect. You might as well go with what does a little bit more damage and is easier to play.

The down side for being imbalanced is generally made out to be something so bad, you are always going to get people locking out Jobs even EW couldn't stop that, Crusading against uniqueness and fun job design doesn't solve this issue at all, it generally just makes the game more boring and worse for everyone.

My last point is people bring up "bring the player not the job" but if every Job is the same then whats the point of having multiple jobs in the first place? I suppose the argument is you can't be locked out of your favourite job anymore but my favourite job being practically deleted was the better solution? aka 6.2 PLD.

[SeverianLyonesse]

I wouldn't necessarily remove Bind and Sleep effects from the game, but you could then spread them out and give them different cast times, target styles, and durations.

BLM could pick up a multi-target sleep effect, SCH could pick up a multi-target Rescue, PLD could get a multi-target Immovable, DRK could get Rampart, but with spikes/damage back. There's lots of design space to make things feel different. Each of those 5-6 role abilities per job would be opportunities for distinction between the jobs in those roles.

See this is the sort of thing that I absolutely agree with. The role actions could all take cues from the different flavors of other job-specific actions and identities.

I would mind less that every job has the same slots in their kit if every ability functioned slightly differently for different playstyles/niche uses. I like these suggestions specifically: BLM multi-sleep (Sleep II), SCH multi-rescue (Regroup), DRK-rampart spikes (Dark Spikes). Other suggestions: bring back Virus as Summoner's variation of Addle; bring back Paladin's Flash as a multi-provoke; bring back Kaiten as Samurai's true north that does additional damage (jk, just bring Kaiten back please). In general I see this idea as having potential to bring back action animations that were removed.

I would also better spread out the available status effects of role actions. Tanks can still stun, but melee DPS shouldn't be able to stun at all; replace it with bleed. Ranged Phys can keep heavy, Magical DPS can keep sleep, but Healers should have Sleep replaced with Blind and Silence I think (and make most dungeon boss skills vulnerable to those statuses). That way Healers can have more proactive, offensive-ish decision-making in between heals that isn't just more DPS, but also in a way that complements casters having outright offensive spells and sleep.

It wouldn't change the balance of trials that substantially, since most of those instances are single-target. But it would make the jobs feel more engaging in dungeons and solo content.

[CaptainLagbeard]

Repose - Removed
Sleep - Removed

Replace Repose with Sleep
Increase the size of Sleep's AoE
Make sleep last a number of attacks to make it function as a stun with separate diminishing returns


Additionally, make BRD's The Warden's Paean into a role skill and replace it with some other support skill.

[Sjol]

There's also the ability to add role-restricted abilities to a job here or there. I don't think BRD having a cleanse is game breaking. RDM and SMN having a rez isn't game breaking either. You could give MNK knockback effects, I like the previously mentioned PLD multi-provoke. I could see a job somewhere getting an invuln ability. I could see DRG with a multi-knockback on Stardiver.

Another thing about a lot of these abilities is that they don't work on bosses anyways. They just add flavor in dungeons, MSQ, FATEs, etc. And these are just ideas being thrown out. Some aren't going to work or won't work with the given kit, but they the intention does seem to counter the current direction that a lot of players seem to be annoyed by. I'm not against reducing button bloat (though I disagree with the term), but if they're going to reduce the number of buttons, the flavor has to come from the parts that are kept and that can be difficult with fewer ingredients.

[Valence]

Damage imbalances are trivial to fix. Increase some potencies, problem solved until next patch.

For foot and leg graze I'd like "additional" Effects

Foot graze for example could cause a small aoe stun on and around the target.
While Leg graze could have a small Reduction effect like 3% that lasts 15s and can be applied around every 60s

Idk I feel like those skills would benefit a lot from additional effects.

Yes please make my role interesting again I beg of you even if it's only worth in dungeons it's still 90% of the game anyway i'll take it ;_;

[Rithy255]

Damage imbalances are trivial to fix. Increase some potencies, problem solved until next patch.



Yes please make my role interesting again I beg of you even if it's only worth in dungeons it's still 90% of the game anyway i'll take it ;_;

I'd love for some added utility to Phys ranged, It says in the job guide they provide support to allies (which they barely do, they have one extra raid wide utility...), Phys ranged will always have to be the lowest DPS category so giving them more to offer rather then just "the 1% buff" would be great. I think it's only fair honestly.

Personally these are just small role action changes, I'm hoping for more then that for phys ranged x).