Healing is not hard

[IDontPetLalas]

Honestly, I get no test server - datamining and spoilers and all that.

...but it would be nice if they'd show us proposed Job changes in advance. I know they stopped doing it because the community were areses about it, so it's yet another "this is why we don't have nice things" situation, but I really would like more of a heads up.

.

That isn't our analogy. As I already told you, the analogy wasn't about speed, it was about which type of vehicle you like.

Just because you're not following a discussion, or in agreement with its direction, doesn't mean you get to dictate the terms. At this point, you're either confused, or being deliberately obtuse.

Here we go again - car model = healer job. Speed = complexity, number of DPS skills added , for the sake of brevity /simplicity. In this case you maintain your healer job, you have a choice in each job as to your DPS skills.

[Renathras]

Just because you're not following a discussion, or in agreement with its direction, doesn't mean you get to dictate the terms. At this point, you're either confused, or being deliberately obtuse.

Here we go again - car model = healer job. Speed = complexity, number of DPS skills added , for the sake of brevity /simplicity. In this case you maintain your healer job, you have a choice in each job as to your DPS skills.

No, you altered the analogy mid-stream to move the goalposts. I pointed this out and talked about the original analogy. There's no point in moving the analogy all the time. It'd be like if I said "Well, you can drive that carbon emitting monster humvee, but you should leave the Prius for we enlightened people who care about each other and the environment" to make your position look bad, too.

...and it would be just as dumb because "speed" and "pollution" don't matter with class design - player enjoyment and class viability in content are what the relevant factors are here. The original analogy reflected this in presenting a bunch of similar car models, with similar features, that were all viable but which some might not find enjoyable to drive while others are perfectly content with, and the idea of adding new car models that have more bells and whistles or aesthetics or overall designs that appeal to those unhappy with the current selection - while keeping existing models for those who ARE happy with the current selection - makes a lot of sense and is a valid argument.

But then you start throwing in extra metrics not part of the initial discussion that alter several of the established axioms of the analogy - specifically metrics where one is OBJECTIVELY better than another, where the distinction now is SUBJECTIVE. That destroys the analogy and makes it invalid. Worse, it's deceptive practice and a goalpost shift to try and salvage a weakened argument (stealmaning) and try to artificially weaken a stronger argument.

If you want to talk about speed, then we're now discussing some completely different metric and we would have to abandon the first analogy and implement a new analogy. Which is fine, but completely gets us back to square one.

I'm neither "confused, or being deliberately obtuse", and I'm the one who IS "following a discussion". You tried a deceptive goalposts shift, and I pointed this out. If you have to be deceitful to win arguments, that just means your position is flawed to begin with.

[IDontPetLalas]

No, you altered the analogy mid-stream to move the goalposts. I pointed this out and talked about the original analogy. There's no point in moving the analogy all the time. It'd be like if I said "Well, you can drive that carbon emitting monster humvee, but you should leave the Prius for we enlightened people who care about each other and the environment" to make your position look bad, too.

...and it would be just as dumb because "speed" and "pollution" don't matter with class design - player enjoyment and class viability in content are what the relevant factors are here. The original analogy reflected this in presenting a bunch of similar car models, with similar features, that were all viable but which some might not find enjoyable to drive while others are perfectly content with, and the idea of adding new car models that have more bells and whistles or aesthetics or overall designs that appeal to those unhappy with the current selection - while keeping existing models for those who ARE happy with the current selection - makes a lot of sense and is a valid argument.

But then you start throwing in extra metrics not part of the initial discussion that alter several of the established axioms of the analogy - specifically metrics where one is OBJECTIVELY better than another, where the distinction now is SUBJECTIVE. That destroys the analogy and makes it invalid. Worse, it's deceptive practice and a goalpost shift to try and salvage a weakened argument (stealmaning) and try to artificially weaken a stronger argument.

If you want to talk about speed, then we're now discussing some completely different metric and we would have to abandon the first analogy and implement a new analogy. Which is fine, but completely gets us back to square one.

I'm neither "confused, or being deliberately obtuse", and I'm the one who IS "following a discussion". You tried a deceptive goalposts shift, and I pointed this out. If you have to be deceitful to win arguments, that just means your position is flawed to begin with.

No one has been altered anything, and given what I highlighted above, it doesn't seem that you're in a healthy state of mind.

[Renathras]

Wow.

You're in rare form today. Now you're a psychoanalyst to try and discredit someone you disagree with on an internet forum online by questioning their state of mind. That's...not healthy. For you.

I'm...just not going to engage with you further right now.

[Sebazy]

Probably for the best after that last one

[Renathras]

Probably for the best after that last one

And here I agreed with you on Diacloud procs. Tut tut.

EDIT:

Tut tut what? I'm not even on the attack with that one, it's just a statement that you're laying more ironic statements ticking people off over things that you yourself have done many a time.

Or have you forgotten the whole 'Are you feeling ok? You're not yourself' phase you went through with several people in the past?

If you want to hand out more ammo, by all means be my guest.

Riiight.

I think I'll pass.

The only times I've asked that is when I'm genuinely concerned about someone who made a complete shift in personality from amicable to highly antagonistic with no cause, in the specific case I'm thinking about, after also just vanishing from the forum for a few weeks. Do you really think IDPL is genuinely concerned for my mental state?

And then she tried to use that to attack me in a completely unrelated thread. If you're concerned with someone's mental state, the last thing you're going to do is both antagonize them AND use your antagonism of them to try to mock them and get others to join in.

[Sebazy]

Tut tut what? I'm not even on the attack with that one, it's just a statement that you're laying more ironic statements ticking people off over things that you yourself have done many a time.

Or have you forgotten the whole 'Are you feeling ok? You're not yourself' phase you went through with several people in the past?

If you want to hand out more ammo, by all means be my guest.

[HappyHubris]

So Ren

Interesting, what I took away from ForsakenRoe (below) is not your 2 year old model. In seems that WOW has recognized that it is no longer 2004 and they need to adapt.

This is amusing, as FFXIV's healing model is so, so much worse than that supposed 2004 rut (let alone later content), but players here have an odd inferiority complex and would happily embrace tedium to stick it to Blizzard.

[SieyaM]

Healing isn't all that hard, but groups end up doing things that make it hard. Such as constantly staying out of range of AoE heals so you have to chase them down.

[Raikai]

I've decided to try Thordan Unreal these days as a healer and the healing checks were much more intense than Zeromus. I know everything was just as scripted, but it has less gaps between the heals. Just shows how the healing design changed from HW.