New hrothgar hairstyles are really bad.

[Midareyukki]

I think there are just too few hrothgar players that SE probably doesn't deem it worthy to dedicate more resources to fix their hairstyles properly.

The total percentage of hrothgar players is like what, 1-2% of the entire playerbase? Especially if you compare to viera who are getting more hairstyles which don't hide their ears and look good. If you want fixes to hrothgar hairs, more people should fantasia to hrothgar so it becomes a more prominent issue and SE can no longer avoid it and just implement half-hearted fixes.

It's not like Viera are any better, let's be honest XD

But this is a flaw on design. We're 2% of the entire playerbase, true. But we make up a larger percentage at endgame\active characters. So which are you really going to make the game for? And should you ostracise people? Is it okay to ostracise them?

And as far as we're aware, they haven't come to us and told us "please stop demanding, we're officially labelling this as a Limited Race". Until then, this race should and is treated like every other. Even if it's implicitly going to be different. And that alone should already be a sign that people need to can the fatalist "Oh you're not enough of the playerbase to matter" and instead treat people equally. Because it doesn't matter if it's implicit or not, we still matter. If Lalafell get entire exclusive areas for them and furniture that only suits them, then it's clear there's a bias toward Lalafell, because no other race has had this preferential treatment. Yet it's implicit; to everyone else, Lalafell are just the same. So it doesn't matter if our numbers are smaller or not, there is no official stance that we're so different we should stop asking for it. All we've had were "Please and excuse us", and that doesn't make an official statement at all. You've all seen what an official statement from Yoshida is.

And people won't fantasia to a race that's obviously incomplete. And they know this, in fact, they hinge on this. To excuse themselves not applying themselves to the topic. And that's what people should be more aware of. We shouldn't have to change. THEY wanted Hrothgar in the game, playable. It's THEIR responsability to fix this, not ours for not playing something that isn't right.

This isn't Diadem. And even Diadem was given THREE chances until it finally worked out.

[Vahlnir]

This isn't Diadem. And even Diadem was given THREE chances until it finally worked out.

It's kinda sad, really, that Diadem was at its best when it became a hollow shell of its former self when they removed basically everything and just threw gathering nodes into it and called it a day.

[DeNada]

It's not like Viera are any better, let's be honest XD

But this is a flaw on design. We're 2% of the entire playerbase, true. But we make up a larger percentage at endgame\active characters. So which are you really going to make the game for? And should you ostracise people? Is it okay to ostracise them?

And as far as we're aware, they haven't come to us and told us "please stop demanding, we're officially labelling this as a Limited Race". Until then, this race should and is treated like every other. Even if it's implicitly going to be different. And that alone should already be a sign that people need to can the fatalist "Oh you're not enough of the playerbase to matter" and instead treat people equally. Because it doesn't matter if it's implicit or not, we still matter. If Lalafell get entire exclusive areas for them and furniture that only suits them, then it's clear there's a bias toward Lalafell, because no other race has had this preferential treatment. Yet it's implicit; to everyone else, Lalafell are just the same. So it doesn't matter if our numbers are smaller or not, there is no official stance that we're so different we should stop asking for it. All we've had were "Please and excuse us", and that doesn't make an official statement at all. You've all seen what an official statement from Yoshida is.

And people won't fantasia to a race that's obviously incomplete. And they know this, in fact, they hinge on this. To excuse themselves not applying themselves to the topic. And that's what people should be more aware of. We shouldn't have to change. THEY wanted Hrothgar in the game, playable. It's THEIR responsability to fix this, not ours for not playing something that isn't right.

This isn't Diadem. And even Diadem was given THREE chances until it finally worked out.

Yup I understand where you are coming from.

Unfortunately, the reality is that development resources are limited and if a particular issue only affects a very small part of the playerbase eg. Hrothgar, SE may simply deem it not economically feasible to dedicate more resources to implement better fixes.

Which was why I suggested that if we want to bring this to the developers attention, having more Hrothgar players could help do that even though it's not ideal.

The other way is for the minority to be extremely vocal such that the larger community becomes aware of the issue and help champion their causes as well. However , this won't be as effective since it has a less visible impact on the revenue/profits and since SE is a business ultimately, the main thing which determines whether something gets attention for fixes or not is the bottom line.

[Midareyukki]

It's kinda sad, really, that Diadem was at its best when it became a hollow shell of its former self when they removed basically everything and just threw gathering nodes into it and called it a day.

I agree xD But it's still an example, like... they tried so hard to make it work. It's not the best iteration of it, but it does work and it DOES bring in more players.

It wasn't on us players to make Diadem any better. Nor is it on us players to make Hrothgar any more appealing to the devs.

They added it in the game. They were the ones who came up with the idea. It's their design, it's their game.

So you want to bring more attention to an already, admittedly, unpopular race? You correct the race. You make it appealing to play. You don't blame the playerbase for it being 2% of the total population. Because I'm sorry but how much are AUS players in comparison to JP, EU and NA combined? By that logic, why the hell did they get a new data center?

And by that logic, you wouldn't have tried so hard with Diadem.

Yup I understand where you are coming from.

Unfortunately, the reality is that development resources are limited and if a particular issue only affects a very small part of the playerbase eg. Hrothgar, SE may simply deem it not economically feasible to dedicate more resources to implement better fixes.

Which was why I suggested that if we want to bring this to the developers attention, having more Hrothgar players could help do that even though it's not ideal.

The other way is for the minority to be extremely vocal such that the larger community becomes aware of the issue and help champion their causes as well. However , this won't be as effective since it has a less visible impact on the revenue/profits and since SE is a business ultimately, the main thing which determines whether something gets attention for fixes or not is the bottom line.

You know we don't need to be a minority, right?

You could be a bit more supportive yourself and express to Square Enix "yo, this isn't right, even if I don't play it, there are players who do want this, please fix it".

That would help A LOT.

[Baxcel]

I think there are just too few hrothgar players that SE probably doesn't deem it worthy to dedicate more resources to fix their hairstyles properly.

The total percentage of hrothgar players is like what, 1-2% of the entire playerbase? Especially if you compare to viera who are getting more hairstyles which don't hide their ears and look good. If you want fixes to hrothgar hairs, more people should fantasia to hrothgar so it becomes a more prominent issue and SE can no longer avoid it and just implement half-hearted fixes.

Alot of us changed to Hrothgar at the launch of ShB and apon finding them lacking changed back to other races for more customization options. Those on PC had an easier time with mods to fix the problems and keep up with a limited option race. Those on PS4/5 moved on or settled for what they had.

If the spike of people changing to Hrothgar in ShB wasn't enough to push SE into making quality updates for the race then a bunch of people changing now would have the same results.

[RanRanTheCat]

I think there are just too few hrothgar players that SE probably doesn't deem it worthy to dedicate more resources to fix their hairstyles properly.

The total percentage of hrothgar players is like what, 1-2% of the entire playerbase? Especially if you compare to viera who are getting more hairstyles which don't hide their ears and look good. If you want fixes to hrothgar hairs, more people should fantasia to hrothgar so it becomes a more prominent issue and SE can no longer avoid it and just implement half-hearted fixes.

God i hate this argument so much it's unreal.
Ask yourself this - why the hrothgar have such low numbers?
Maybe because people who were playing hrothgar a ton quit the race because of, not only the ingame harassment from other people, but also because of three years of broken promises and general dissatisfaction with how the race is? I have heard A LOT of people say "i'll wait for 6.1 to see the new hair things they'll do and maybe come back then", and they never do because it is THAT lackluster of fixes.
Your argument is actually exactly reverse of what it is, because devs should look at those numbers and think "huh, why nobody plays them, i guess we fucked up somewhere down the line".
Again. Majority of hrothgar populace switched off hrothgar a LONG TIME AGO, and never came back because for some reasons devs neglected the race.

[Belauron]

I would like to go back to being a Hrothgar played most of Shadowbringers as one, sadly after a while i had to race change due to the fact I had to use a Fanta to change my hairstyle, and the whole no hats (I main Rdm and whats an Rdm without his hat) and the hunch why do beast races have to get such a bad back (i know about the /cpose but even then the avatar just looks down and to the right)

These just slowly got on my nerves till i just thought what's the point and became a generic highlander

[Akimori]

I think there are just too few hrothgar players that SE probably doesn't deem it worthy to dedicate more resources to fix their hairstyles properly.

The total percentage of hrothgar players is like what, 1-2% of the entire playerbase? Especially if you compare to viera who are getting more hairstyles which don't hide their ears and look good. If you want fixes to hrothgar hairs, more people should fantasia to hrothgar so it becomes a more prominent issue and SE can no longer avoid it and just implement half-hearted fixes.

Hrothgar #s are low because they're too limited in their customization and up until patch 6.1, had to pay money to even change their hair. But SEdoesnt want to do anything because the hrothgar player population is low....its a vicious cycle

[einschwartz]

I think there are just too few hrothgar players that SE probably doesn't deem it worthy to dedicate more resources to fix their hairstyles properly.

The total percentage of hrothgar players is like what, 1-2% of the entire playerbase? Especially if you compare to viera who are getting more hairstyles which don't hide their ears and look good. If you want fixes to hrothgar hairs, more people should fantasia to hrothgar so it becomes a more prominent issue and SE can no longer avoid it and just implement half-hearted fixes.

Oh a lot of us switch to Hrothgar when they're live. Myself included.
But as others have said, the lack of customization on top of needing fantasia (and many other things) left a pretty bad taste. Especially after some in-game time you see that your Hrothgar is similar to 2 or 3 other Hrothgars... hmm yeah. I don't feel so unique afterall.

As I've said in my post early in this thread, SE should take steps to make the race more apealing / less restrictive. Not push people away from it even further but removing the ears or think they can get away by giving Hrothgar hairstyles that doesn't suit them.

[Balmung_Griffin]

The Hrothgar need a re-design from the top down. The "trick" they do to put us in hoods or to put the ears back on the head is just making something invisible - not moving an asset from one position to another. That's probably going to need to move some parts around, and it may involve putting bones where they belong
My problem is that when you code in a kludge, the eventual re-work is foreseeable. And it's not something they want to do. And that's why I have dug in my heels and said I DO NOT WANT THE EARS PUT BACK ON THESE CRAPPY HAIRCUTS BECAUSE YOU WILL NEVER COME BACK AND FIX THE PROBLEM CORRECTLY.

So, again, if you want to help me out putting this in a video for err'body, please contact me on Twitter.

This is a great post.
And exactly why I'm always advocating for exclusive, tailor made hairstyles for Hrothgar.

"Fixing the ears" on those hairstyles or having more of the human hairs will always have variants of the same old problems.

The ideal solution as you pointed out, is to start over, that said, they made it this way for a reason (imagine a Roegadyn with some beastial features) and ultimately I think we would have a worse version of them.