Petition for the Devs to listen to actual pvpers

[RyanCousland]

Hullo everyone this is a petition for the Devs to listen to players that actually enjoy PvP but have experienced the many issues within its current state. If you have any ideas as to what you'd like to see implemented please share, looking forward to having a productive conversation to move PvP forward in a better direction.

If you do not like PvP please do not post here, I understand you may not like PvP, whether it's the concept entirely or maybe you had a bad experience but there are players who do enjoy it and will endeavor to make it better.

I'd like to start of the petition with some requests
I've seen on the forum as well as some of my own personal preference
1: 8 man premades be allowed back in Frontline
2: allowing players to choose their grand company for Frontline
3: having crystal conflict either allow premades for ranked or have a team ranked option
4: if crystal conflict doesn't implement premade then bring feast back as a team based PvP
5: if crystal conflict implements premade then bring feast back as a solo 1v1 tournament based style
6: remove experience & tomestones from PvP
7: create a separate roulette for pvp
8: reduce Frontline combatant number lower than 72
9: add more maps to Frontline and rival wings

Some of these you may not agree with, (even I don't agree with some too) but whether you agree or disagree please be bit courteous and cogent with your input, also if you have any ideas feel free to share!

[Moonlite]

Is it just me or does this just come across as I want to create as many opportunities to steam roll others? Anything that allows steam rolling will be removed. This game is the poster child for casual friendly.



PvP popped before exp, it wouldn't be the end of the world. Not sure why people would want tomestones removed? We never had trolling when it was just tomestones.



A rework of all the maps to reduce from 72 to 24 would be nice. When we had 24 you could get pops at night. More maps/game types is work and they seem to have a limited amount for pvp. But if mode was smaller maybe they could have 2 or 3 maps that are the same.



Also you semi new devs/community team almost never come here. We are thee far reaches of the FF community.

[Ixon]

Unfortunately, a lot of your changes DID exist, and most were removed shortly after ShB launch. I personally like the 8-man premade, could always queue with FC mates, and never faulted anyone for grouping up with other decent PVP players for a better chance at winning and generally having more fun. The issue is MOST people are solo queue-ers, and being as uncoordinated as Frontlines is, people got steamrolled by the premades, and instead of grouping up themselves, they just asked for them to be gone until they were. Grand Company allegiance was a thing too, but what ended up happening is this "All the good PVPers are on X Grand Company" and a lot of the time even in solo queue the skill of the teams would be heavily skewed. Not to mention at the time of Onsal, a lot of people grouped into the same GC(self included) so we would have a better chance of being on the same team, so that got removed.

Crystal Conflict MAY get a team ranked mode IF it get's popular enough. Problem with last team ranked seasons is there wasn't enough people participating per data center to make it remotely enjoyable. Feast probably won't come back if this new mode explodes. 1v1's "might" work with how the new jobs work, will have to see if it's balanced enough for that.

I personally still want exp and tomes from PVP, I just think the gap between what get when you win, and what you get when you lose, should be widened to make people want to win. There is something to do with the backend duty finder code as to why they couldn't put all the PVP in one big roulette button, but maybe this will happen in the future. Probably more Frontline maps in the future, Rival Wings I think they are still figuring out as it isn't a popular mode.

[Moonlite]

Crystal Conflict MAY get a team ranked mode IF it get's popular enough. Problem with last team ranked seasons is there wasn't enough people participating per data center to make it remotely enjoyable. Feast probably won't come back if this new mode explodes. 1v1's "might" work with how the new jobs work, will have to see if it's balanced enough for that.

So the population is pretty thin for team mode. Originally I had hoped when they mentioned cross data centre it would take place at the duty finder level. That clearly isn't in the cards. I wonder if they would pick one data centre for team and everyone would have to slip over to that one for team matches. It would be very clunky system. But I think if all PvPers were region NA. EU, and JPN instead of data centres they would actually have a very healthy population.

[Novani]

1: 8 man premades be allowed back in Frontline
2: allowing players to choose their grand company for Frontline

Fundamental problem with these two requests: the player base is largely responsible for the calls to even change that in the first place, back when the meta was stacking the "winning" Grand Company and rolling into matches with doomstack premades and steamrolling a specific GC of choice over and over, don't say it didn't happen, the first week of Onsal Hakair(Danshig Naadam) was literally full of it on some data centers, kudos to those who at least had a better experience but it's not universal. Not long after GCs were made irrelevant and the premade limits we know now were put in place, it's not perfect and it's definitely not as restrictive as people make it out to be. But things were a lot worse for general enjoyment back then, especially for solo queuers, of which there are many to this day.

It was not uncommon to see whole teams just depressingly giving up even before the first engagement, and I mean this in their tone of conversation, not just their actions. After all; you lost the last 100 matches what's to say this is different because you got slotted on the losing grand company. This made it exceptionally difficult to motivate people into fighting back and engage in the activity, their consolation was the XP, but for people who genuinely enjoy PvP, they were more or less stuck, because the meta was against them every time they queued, unless they stopped freelancing/queuing as their losing GC and joined the winning grand company, further intensifying the problem.

Who wants to engage in a match, or a mode, like that. Does that sound even remotely healthy?

I get that some people have rosy views of how things used to be, but consider for a moment just how things were on the other shoe, and consider the repercussions if it was allowed to continue ad nauseum. Frontline and Feast would be practically indistinguishable. Hopefully things will work out with the new changes, time will tell. Only thing that remains true throughout all of this is our collective conduct will make or break the modes as they stand. Can't attract any but the most stubborn new players if all they hear is doom and gloom. And people wanting a good experience can't feel satisfied if everything plays out the same every time either.

[Cash12121]

1. It has been shown 8 man premades end up winning way too often in fronlines. Already 4 man premades are already win more often. So increasing to 8 can potentially cause an imbalance.
2. No reason for this. You're doing this for achivement reasons. Your current active Grand Company progresses the achivement. Not the one you queue into. Also grand company stacking was an issue.
3. Casual Premades. Very much yes or at least duo queue. (if not there once maintence is up). Team ranked I hope for the future and I expect they'll be looking into this hopefully.
4. Feast does not need to return. It's sad to see it go. But it isn't good in the new system.
5. Solo 1v1? You mean just duels. Not feast. Would be cool as a small queue but we do have wolves den pier for that.
6. No. Removing rewards won't help on attracting people to play. I assume you suggest this because there are people who grief who just want "Quick EXP". Yeah that is a problem. However you can file a report or vote kick them. GMs do listen to these reports.
7. I assume more roulettes past Frontlines. Yes please. I would love a Rival Wings roulette. Crystal Conflict too for it's casual matches.
8. Eh? 72 or 24 I wouldn't care having either or. I prefer 72mans because it's just chaotic and fun to see.
9. More are always welcome. We already have 4 for Frontlines so not a big deal but more is always welcome. Having another Rival Wings map would be cool. Honestly more maps in all planned supported PvP modes would be great. So seeing more revaled will make me hype.

[Sinstrel]

I mentioned this before but they could give us a Group Ranked mode in Crystal Conflict. Something that lets us use party finder to assemble a group, allowing us to set which riser rank we are queing in, mandatory 1 player per job, and requires a pre-made group to que. This would give us the option for pre-made vs pre-made while also letting people play with their friends, and would not restrict us to playing with a set team of players from your own world who also happen to have the same schedule as you.

I would even like something like this in Frontline, an option for pre-made only ques 8v8v8. Pre-mades were never the problem, it was Pre-mades being matched VS. random solo casual people that was the problem. It might not be popular, but at least we'd have the option to form up and do it.

[Cidel]

Is it just me or does this just come across as I want to create as many opportunities to steam roll others? Anything that allows steam rolling will be removed. This game is the poster child for casual friendly.

Because it is. No matter how anyone tries to wrap it up nicely and put a bow on it, party-sized premades were often and regularly a legit method to stacking the deck in their favor. The issue was always people engaging in it easily access a coordination that is largely unheard of from people using roulette/solo-queue. It was the most effective method of farming wins for Frontlines achievements; and while it sounds harmless in theory, in practice it often imbalanced entire matches by their mere presence. Grand company stacking wasn't too different either, as Novani already accurately outlined. I'm sure there's some people in good faith who lament not being able to play with more than 3 other friends on the same team, but I'm convinced a lot of others simply want the ability to stack a party and be oppressive against solo-queuers under those pretenses.

Ranked Feast had to separate solo from preformed for this obvious fact. You can only hope there will be a different ranking for teams in Crystal Conflict in the same vein, but as we've already seen, that enjoyed less popularity. I'm sure they'll be watching Crystal Conflict to gauge the player interest.

[KageTokage]

Having experienced full DNC premades prior to the potency on their step abilities getting nerfed, having them gone from Frontlines was definitely for the better.

Given how strong some of the new LBs in 6.1 are, I could easily see similar coordination being...problematic unless it's strictly against other premade teams.

[Ayche]

I have played enough games, anykind of multiplayer games to know that auto-balance is the first thing you enforce.
Never ever trust the player to make teams fair.