The MSQ Endwalker Trial Bosses are WAY too hard for newer players to FFXIV

[ForteNightshade]

I can't say I'm all that much of a fan of the trials past stormblood, mainly because they just stack on more and more crap going on. More mechanics with terrible telegraphs with layers of mechanics that if you fail one you die to the second. During the trials of endwalker, even though they were cleared, i felt like a waste of oxygen when i got out of them since i was dead way too much due to not knowing the mechanics beforehand on top of a single mistake meaning instant death. Normal trials/dungeons etc should not require a guide or multiple wipes to figure out, that's for the extremes.

If they continue to ramp the difficulty every expansion there will eventually be a point where people just call it quits because they don't feel they can pass a mandatory boss without a full premade on voice comms.

And why not? Why should the normal modes be so easy they're all but impossible to fail? This is precisely why dungeons are treated like a complete joke and the community insists on speed running them. Not that they should be overly difficult, which they currently aren't, but if we're making them on the level of Thordan then just have the bosses toss you a coffer when you zone in.

[Flashock]

I thought they were perfectly tuned.

Each of the 3 new trials had a couple wipes before figuring it out. As it should be.
Just hard enough to make you feel like you accomplished something important but not too hard that it was frustrating.
Now my groups, were average at best, but I could see if you got a below average group that it would appear extra challenging.

Ofcourse after gearing, and clearing the extreme versions, those normal trials feel ultra easy.

But I do believe adding maybe a reduced echo to MSQ trials could be a good thing for those sub par groups.
Maybe have it cap out at 5-10-15 or something.

[Ultaniku]

The only thing that I personally found difficult was a certain mechanic in the first trial I couldn’t wrap my head around. I figured it out, but it just took a bit too long for that to happen admittedly. I think they had the right amount of challenge for story trials.

[Kuroka]

It's Zodiark. THE big bad. The one we've been hearing about for years. It's not meant to be taken lightly.

Well no, it was basically only an incomplete husk as we already killed his heart, yet... for ex i wished some "he grabs his remaining frangments and becomes whole again" stuff...

[Liam_Harper]

As always, I'd recommend ignoring the "trials were super easy, if you didn't clear them first time you have no brain" comments. The trials had some tricky mechanics. If it took you a while to figure them out or you died a lot that's fine. A lot of frustration can often stem from people reading so often that content is "braindead", wondering why they die so easily and getting annoyed both at themselves and the game. It's normal to die. Ultimate raiders die in Normal content all the time.

However, a few wipes are fine too. It means your story trial takes half an hour, which is a drop compared to the whole time taken from 1-90. You feel you accomplished something (or not if you don't work that way) but either way you get it done fine and move on with the game.
The concept that everything in the story must be faceroll is player invented. It's a combat based MMO. The devs have made it accessible in that you have unlimited Raises, healer lb3's, no enrage timer, lots of mechanics that don't kill you if you mess them up, but they still intend fights to be a puzzle to figure out and to kill you many times as you do solve them. The WoL having struggles against god-like foes is literally part of story, immersion and game fantasy. You aren't meant to just glance at them and win.

[technole]

As always, I'd recommend ignoring the "trials were super easy, if you didn't clear them first time you have no brain" comments. The trials had some tricky mechanics. If it took you a while to figure them out or you died a lot that's fine. A lot of frustration can often stem from people reading so often that content is "braindead", wondering why they die so easily and getting annoyed both at themselves and the game. It's normal to die. Ultimate raiders die in Normal content all the time.

However, a few wipes are fine too. It means your story trial takes half an hour, which is a drop compared to the whole time taken from 1-90. You feel you accomplished something (or not if you don't work that way) but either way you get it done fine and move on with the game.
The concept that everything in the story must be faceroll is player invented. It's a combat based MMO. The devs have made it accessible in that you have unlimited Raises, healer lb3's, no enrage timer, lots of mechanics that don't kill you if you mess them up, but they still intend fights to be a puzzle to figure out and to kill you many times as you do solve them. The WoL having struggles against god-like foes is literally part of story, immersion and game fantasy. You aren't meant to just glance at them and win.

Sure. I die in normal content all the time because of not getting healed, or healers trapped focused elsewhere/raising instead of keeping the party alive.

Wipes alone don't clearly explain the picture, you can have the best players and all it takes is a healer or tank loss and things can go chaotic real fast.

[Sauteed]

Please stop asking them to tone these trials / game in general/ dungeons down.

I was pleased to see some actual challenges for a change. Most of the content is a yawn-fest and boring as heck these days. Let the game toss a curve ball or two.

[Packetdancer]

More than that, don't let these people in any Roulette.

Brief digression, but I actually don't think you should be able to get anything in roulette you haven't cleared, regardless of anything else in this thread. (I.e., anything that has the checkmark on it in Duty Finder.) To put this another way: if Player A has just unlocked the next story dungeon, I don't think leveling roulette should be able to give them that dungeon until they've queued into it directly and cleared it that way.

This is as much for the people queuing into things as anyone else. I know a friend who was waiting for their significant other to catch up in MSQ this expansion before going into the first dungeon; leveling roulette threw them in there anyway rather than letting them wait, much to their dismay. I can easily imagine someone unlocking the level 83 trial, going "I'll wait for my friend to be on since we were going to do this together", queuing into trial roulette for a quick run, and -- because of how many people were going through story -- hitting the level 83 trial in that roulette.

[hynaku]

If want dutys harder or easier there should be a option like they have for solo duty fighting quests. Problem solved

[Packetdancer]

Sure. I die in normal content all the time because of not getting healed, or healers trapped focused elsewhere/raising instead of keeping the party alive.

Wipes alone don't clearly explain the picture, you can have the best players and all it takes is a healer or tank loss and things can go chaotic real fast.

Truth.

I mean, I've been running the normal-mode raids repeatedly (because the queue pops quickly) as a way to work on honing my ability to play SGE efficiently at 90 prior to savage dropping. (My co-healer is interested in going AST instead of SCH this tier, so thus I swap from WHM to SGE.) I have thus done P2N many, many times; I've been in runs where we blasted through the fight in like 5 minutes, everyone went "tyfp" and we bounced.

I still had a run where I spent an hour in there the other day, because almost everyone else was new, and folks didn't know where to go, and people would die to the water DoT and so on. I and the other veteran offered explanations, and I eventually marked myself with the Safety Dorito to help illustrate what I meant, and we did get folks through, but it was rough.

We had no rezzers other than the healers, and my co-healer was one of the other first-timers; I often ended up in a scenario where I had to try to get folks back up, heal up those who are still alive (as one of my static would say, "Tend to the living!"), and do mechanics, and those were not three things I could do simultaneously. So we ended up in a war of attrition since I could only slow-rez people so many times without dying to mechanics myself. And it wasn't because folks were inherently bad, but they were all new to the fight and trying to learn it, and we had a party composition which did not lend itself well to recovering from mistakes.

Sometimes, you get a run that just be like that.