People advertising they're running Parsers

[TaleraRistain]

So I haven't seen this explained. Is this "Barser" thing so people can get around a restriction of the word "parser" in PF descriptions? Because if so, that kind of speaks for itself on why they shouldn't be doing it and should expect that they could find themselves reported. Parsers are against ToS. The dev teams knows they're used. They give the parsing community an "out" by making it clear that if they don't mention them in a way SE can prove they're in use, then there isn't action they can take. It's like someone said earlier with getting clever with descriptions. If the GM can't find evidence to prove it, then they can't enforce the ToS on them. "Barser" isn't really that clever. and I would imagine falls under the same auspices with people trying to get around name restrictions.

[Rinhi]

Actually, I do. The moral of the story is to not be indifferent to the plight of others because one day others might be indifferent to your own plight.

why should that make me care about this literal non-issue, though?
besides, """my""" plights are already getting ignored and excused by this great community, so you're barking up the wrong tree when it comes to this lmao

all I'm thinking when I see people decrying personal parsers with excuses like "uuuh WoW bad", them being "toxic" and reasons such as "uuummm you see, back when I played WoW...", I usually see a person who must have 'good' reasons for being against them, though those not being the ones they obviously post about
but hey, I'm probably toxic for thinking that, right?

[Rilifane]

There will be no official parser, i dont know how many times this needs to be stated.

As for attitude, i tend to find that anyone who sneeringly refers to others as "deadweights" is ample proof of why parsers should be completely banned. i dont mean allow them for personal use, i mean BANNED. Removed. Forbidden.

I dont see any reason why this kind of attitude, this kind of hostile, abusive conduct towards others should be condoned, encouraged or rewarded in any sense whatsoever.

I quit WOW for that very reason, and the abusive, manipulative and toxic atmospheres they created. Allow parsers in the game, and on the foilowing day you will have some wannabe spamming parser numbers in Sastasha. It wont happen?

Yes, it will. I gaurantee it.

Lastly, any so called 'raid leader" who cannot, or WILL NOT, get their point across without screaming obscenities at the top of their lungs needs to uninstall the game. walk away, and take a good long hard look at themselves.

If you lose your mind this badly over a game, if THIS is how you treat others, then the problem aint the game.

Curious how "identifying a problem backed up with numbers" is automatically "screaming obscenities at the top of their lungs".

So, let me give you a quite realistic scenario about a static:
the static managed to play mechanics consistently but they keep wiping to enrage. Not just once or twice, no, it's always that damn enrage. Not just by 1-2% but by a noticable amount, let's say something close to 10%.
Something needs to be done about dps because it's obviously not as high as it should be but since nobody runs or is allowed to run a parser, upload the logs to fflogs and plug them into xiva, you can't tell who is not pulling their weight. Maybe you'll look at the aggro table and see MT and OT as 1st and 2nd, then come the 4 DPS and healers on 7th and 8th.
Alright, looks completely fine, yes?
Okay, let's look at the 4 DPS specifically. The SAM with the Dance Partner is 3rd, great! As it should be. SMN and DRG are 4th and 5th, sometimes one is ahead, sometimes the other. DNC is 6th. Looks fine.

Except that tanks are supposed to be 1st and 2nd in aggro and they will be even if their dps is low. Healers will be 7th and 8th, whether their dps is low or high. The aggro rankings for DPS only give you a rough idea but not about how much ahead someone is. The SAM with DP could be barely out-dpsing the SMN/ DRG by something like 100 dps but they still appear ahead because of the DP padding. A DNC being 6th could mean they're barely ahead of the healers in terms of dps or maybe they're the star DPS of the group. Who knows?

So, what will the raid lead do?
"We keep wiping to enrage, we should all focus on doing more dps to make it. We can do it! We got this, mates, just focus on getting your rotation right!"?
People can feel great or bad for their performance all day, without clear numbers it's just a feeling and the better informed a raid lead is, the better decisions they can make. Now they have information to accurately identify problems and approach the people that need to work most on pulling their weight.
Informed decisions are always better than uninformed ones.
How they get delivered is up to each person and you're naive if you think that just because a raid lead doesn't run a parser, he'll be Mr. supportive nice guy and just because someone does, they'd automatically be the toxic elitist, insulting everyone and their moms.

Parsers itself are not toxic.
Some players can be toxic and they will be, regardless of parsers existing or not.
What reins them in are ToS and their strict enforcement.
But someone who uses a parser isn't automatically problematic. Only someone who uses them to openly insult others is - but that's what reports are for.

[_Pigzig]

ban em all

[Shurrikhan]

Tl;dr:

If you don't want your performance scrutinized, don't do content for which that scrutiny would be relevant. Done.

Similarly, if you want to do content in which you must perform decently in order not to unfairly hold back your group, one must 'get good'. Parsers, as it happens, are also a useful learning tool for that exact purpose.

Meanwhile, harassment is a punishable offense, yes. But kicking someone from a group doing content for which one is underprepared to point of offense is not.

[Thoosa]

I’d love a parser on PS, it’s good to know how I’m doing and how everyone else is.

[RocciaSolida]

Wait I thought it was the raiders the toxic ones

[Jybril]

I thought SE stance was "don't ask, don't tell".
So this is reportable, right?
"Barser" isn't very clever lol.

[Xrystofer]

why should that make me care about this literal non-issue, though?
besides, """my""" plights are already getting ignored and excused by this great community, so you're barking up the wrong tree when it comes to this lmao

all I'm thinking when I see people decrying personal parsers with excuses like "uuuh WoW bad", them being "toxic" and reasons such as "uuummm you see, back when I played WoW...", I usually see a person who must have 'good' reasons for being against them, though those not being the ones they obviously post about
but hey, I'm probably toxic for thinking that, right?

People are not against parsing, as long as you keep it to yourself all is good. The problem is that parsing promotes toxicity and the current rules keep that toxicity in check.

Also, I don't think that ruining someone's experience with toxic behavior is a non-issue. Most content in this game doesn't require optimal DPS. If you want to parse with your friends, kudos to you. Just don't bring it up in party finder.

[RocciaSolida]

People are not against parsing, as long as you keep it to yourself all is good. The problem is that parsing promotes toxicity and the current rules keep that toxicity in check.

Also, I don't think that ruining someone's experience with toxic behavior is a non-issue. Most content in this game doesn't require optimal DPS. If you want to parse with your friends, kudos to you. Just don't bring it up in party finder.

Ok but literally no one is forcing you to join a "barse" party. People that join know what they're throwing themselves into.
How is that an issue?