Are some jobs 'too feminine' in aesthetics?

[MoofiaBossVal]

This is not limited to FFXIV, pretty much every healer in any RPG is
"green nature magic"
or
"white priest"

Maybe add white labcoat doctor for a third.
Dare you to find anything else.

LotRO has bards who sings and play music to heal, which is in line with the setting as musical melodies and spoken words actually hold magical power.

Aforementioned blood mage/drainer healer that siphons the lifeforce of his enemies and channels them into his friends. Another variation of this was GW1's Ritualist, who summons the spirits of the dead and used their lifeforce to heal the living.

STO and GW2 have engineer healers who lay down generators that expel healing gas and stab people with hyposprays/stimpacks to heal them.

[KizuyaKatogami]

It is what it is. If your friend isn't into WHM and DNC, then they're welcome to play jobs with animations they likes more.

Personally, I think it's a silly complaint and makes them just look super insecure.

Ah yes because lord have mercy that people have their own opinions. Don’t see how it makes them look insecure. It is kind of funny to me though that people like you make comments saying oh he must be insecure or, he must have confidence or identity issues, yet this is never mentioned whenever people are constantly pestering and asking for say, a male maid outfit or the like. Interesting how it seems to only ever come up when people rightfully complain about the constant femininity in the game in relations to jobs or glams…. On a fun note btw, the first white mage in the series(not counting the unvoiced one in ff1,) was a male. Seems people don’t know that.

[Katie_Kitty]

Ah yes because lord have mercy that people have their own opinions. Don’t see how it makes them look insecure. It is kind of funny to me though that people like you make comments saying oh he must be insecure or, he must have confidence or identity issues, yet this is never mentioned whenever people are constantly pestering and asking for say, a male maid outfit or the like. Interesting how it seems to only ever come up when people rightfully complain about the constant femininity in the game in relations to jobs or glams…. On a fun note btw, the first white mage in the series(not counting the unvoiced one in ff1,) was a male. Seems people don’t know that.

Well there's a pretty big difference between this and the example you gave. For one thing, "Male maid outfits" is more along the lines of complaining about devs forcing traditional gender roles on people by actively disallowing male characters from wearing particular gear. If you want your male character to wear a maid outfit, or any other outfit, I support you 100%! Even if it's a masculine outfit believe it or not. But square is not gender-locking plate armor to female characters so the comparison is pretty ridiculous.

Now, let's take a look at what the actual issue here is in this case. Jobs have different animations for different abilities, we can all agree on that. But what this post is doing is complaining about that. So what's the solution? Do we need square to enforce gender roles in job animations by creating separate (more "manly" *eyeroll*) animations for male dancers and white mages? What happens then to players who want their male dancer or white mage to utilize the same graceful animations as the female ones? Are they just out of luck or does square need to create a setting that allows you to pick and choose "male" or "female" animations?

At the end of the day, a dancer is a dancer and a white mage is a white mage. You're welcome to play dancer and white mage if you like, regardless of gender. But I think it's pretty silly to say "My male white mage needs to be more manly." If you're so concerned about how manly your character is, then why play White Mage? Plenty of tanks and DPS out there who won't make you feel bad about yourself, and even scholar/sage. But I guess having a fairy isn't manly enough either huh?

[MirielleLavandre]

But what this post is doing is complaining about that. So what's the solution? Do we need square to enforce gender roles in job animations by creating separate (more "manly" *eyeroll*) animations for male dancers and white mages? What happens then to players who want their male dancer or white mage to utilize the same graceful animations as the female ones? Are they just out of luck or does square need to create a setting that allows you to pick and choose "male" or "female" animations?

Actually, my friend and I were just joking around when he mentioned this - and no, we're not talking about the combat animations of the characters, but rather the spell animations of the skills/spells (the big lily for Holy 3, the lily for Afflatus Misery, and now the heart shaped Lilybell). He just thinks the jobs skill animations are becoming really feminized, which I agree with.

As he and I are both Japanese, we usually don't need to worry about concepts such as 'gendering' things, as this kind of idea is really foreign to us and most all of our friends. He's not strange or insecure or anything - if anything, he puts more time into his real life appearance than many men (he uses moisturizer from Korea, etc.) and looks kinda like the new bunny boys in appearance/body type. It was just a casual observation, which I agree with - he even said jokingly that WHM was almost turning into a 'magical girl' - of the type seen in common manga/anime. So, please don't think he is insecure or against feminine things or being biased. It was merely an observation which it seems some, at least, agree with ^^

[Katie_Kitty]

Actually, my friend and I were just joking around when he mentioned this - and no, we're not talking about the combat animations of the characters, but rather the spell animations of the skills/spells (the big lily for Holy 3, the lily for Afflatus Misery, and now the heart shaped Lilybell). He just thinks the jobs skill animations are becoming really feminized, which I agree with.

As he and I are both Japanese, we usually don't need to worry about concepts such as 'gendering' things, as this kind of idea is really foreign to us and most all of our friends. He's not strange or insecure or anything - if anything, he puts more time into his real life appearance than many men (he uses moisturizer from Korea, etc.) and looks kinda like the new bunny boys in appearance/body type. It was just a casual observation, which I agree with - he even said jokingly that WHM was almost turning into a 'magical girl' - of the type seen in common manga/anime. So, please don't think he is insecure or against feminine things or being biased. It was merely an observation which it seems some, at least, agree with ^^

I'm sure your friend is perfectly secure. I just think it's a silly complaint that makes people look insecure when they get really upset about it. Like, for example, you never see anyone complaining that Dark knight animations are too manly for female characters. Or, "Why aren't there more dresses for female Dark Knights?" It's just kinda silly thing to get super worked up over that's all.

[LioJen]

Well tanks specifically have many long skirts, dress-like robes and soft clothing to choose from while healers don't really have any solid armor options to match.

[Wasselin]

So what? I like WHM and just because some of their skills are elegant looking or they have frilly artifact gear sometimes doesn't mean it can't be played by men. I think the White Mage should lean more into the flower / lily theme because it makes sense with the conjurer roots of the job and kind of ties everything together better. It would be cool if the limit break was changed to a flower field aesthetic like the end of FFVIII. The flower aesthetic also reminds me of Aerith from Final Fantasy VII, who while not technically a White Mage, did cast Holy.

Although I do wish the Lilybell looked more natural, like the lily bell plant instead of how it looks now, which kind of reminds me of a themepark statue or something from minigolf.

I'm also always for more diversity in gear and White Mage does have a lot of gown-like robes. It would be neat to have something like Robin's alternate outfit from Smash Bros or something with a cape like Rosa from FFIV or Minwu from FFII.

[Xirean]

So what? I like WHM and just because some of their skills are elegant looking or they have frilly artifact gear sometimes doesn't mean it can't be played by men. I think the White Mage should lean more into the flower / lily theme because it makes sense with the conjurer roots of the job and kind of ties everything together better. It would be cool if the limit break was changed to a flower field aesthetic like the end of FFVIII. The flower aesthetic also reminds me of Aerith from Final Fantasy VII, who while not technically a White Mage, did cast Holy.

Although I do wish the Lilybell looked more natural, like the lily bell plant instead of how it looks now, which kind of reminds me of a themepark statue or something from minigolf.

I'm also always for more diversity in gear and White Mage does have a lot of gown-like robes. It would be neat to have something like Robin's alternate outfit from Smash Bros or something with a cape like Rosa from FFIV or Minwu from FFII.

This sounds super cool! Kinda like Sephirot's phase change move.

[Risvertasashi]

While it's obvious that healer gear tends to be designed for females first, FF14's glamor system at least flexible enough - and there's enough varieties of gear in the game now - that you can choose your look pretty freely. (Not as freely as I wish we could, but that's a topic for another thread...)

Also, games that genderlock your healer character into being female make me really appreciate the choices and options that FF14 gives.

[Fukuro]

So what? I like WHM and just because some of their skills are elegant looking or they have frilly artifact gear sometimes doesn't mean it can't be played by men. I think the White Mage should lean more into the flower / lily theme because it makes sense with the conjurer roots of the job and kind of ties everything together better. It would be cool if the limit break was changed to a flower field aesthetic like the end of FFVIII. The flower aesthetic also reminds me of Aerith from Final Fantasy VII, who while not technically a White Mage, did cast Holy.

even tho i like the spells i can‘t lie and say i miss the old feeling of white mage sometimes. i don‘t think the flower/lily theme particularly matches the conjurer theme in comparison to aero or stone skills that were taken away from it‘s kit.
the massive and powerful hitting stone skill, that amazing animation of aero III… gave me more of that conjurer „feel“.