Female Hrothgar as a playable race. Show your support!

[SturmChurro]

The reason for not adding male Viera was not because we haven't seen male Viera before; it was that they wanted to add Hrothgar but also wanted to add Viera. Has nothing to do with not seeing male Viera in the past.

From the way Yoshida words it. He looks to be willing to add both male viera/female hrothgar, regardless of male viera not being seen before. It's the development cost of adding the equivalent of another new race that is stopping them.

ANOTHER new race after male viera/female hrothgar? Now I don't see that happening.

[-JayJay-]

ANOTHER new race after male viera/female hrothgar? Now I don't see that happening.

Now this here really stings. I would've been behind something like the Burmecians as a potential new race after the current races get "completed". But after the "These might be the last new playable races" statement and this whole situation with the newly implemented ones, that idea was just immediately tossed out the window. It's really disappointing, but whatever I guess.

[Amnmaat]

Now this here really stings. I would've been behind something like the Burmecians as a potential new race after the current races get "completed". But after the "These might be the last new playable races" statement and this whole situation with the newly implemented ones, that idea was just immediately tossed out the window. It's really disappointing, but whatever I guess.

What's more surprising is how every FF after XII has gone away from using animals/beasts or beast-like races at all. For someone that loves beast-like races like YoshiP does, it's surprising there's 0 indication that we'll see any of that in this very modern game called FFXVI. While the settings dabble in medeival architecture, the rest of what they showed seem very modern. Didn't leave much room for beast tribe-like people.

As far as more races in XIV, yeah I kinda wish they could expand the 2D and 3D artists division within the XIV team to crank out more races. If they really want XIV to go on forever like they said recently, why not expand it a bit more. A Burmecian race or moogle race would be a great addition.

[VirusOnline]

It's the development cost of adding the equivalent of another new race that is stopping them.

Ok. No one asked for this, but I have some free time and my curiosity is once again asking for evidence or support.
So, I did some digging. Like. Google first result digging. To my surprise, Square Enix publicly displays their Fiscal Years. If we examine each year since the launch of ARR, can we find any insight into the costs ?
*This is my own personal research. I am not maths persone. I am not accountant. I am (mostly) elezen. This is a simple overview.

Fiscal Year ? One year period of a company's financial reporting.
Ex: From 2013 April 1 - 2014 March 31, SE had a comprehensive income gain of ¥9,045M (Read: approx. $85.8M USD).

--------
Comprehensive income overview of Square Enix Earnings from 2012 April 1 - 2020 March

1) 2013 March --------->[EXTRAORDINARY LOSSES; comprehensive LOSS from 2012 at -¥11,881M (Read: $112.7M)]
Expansion) 2013 August > ARR release
2) 2014 March --------->[ Comprehensive income gain of ¥9,045M (Read: $85.8M) ]
3) 2015 March --------->[ 48.4% increase from 2014 at ¥13,427M (Read: $127.4M) ]
Expansion) 2015 June > HW release
4) 2016 March --------->[ 26.2% increase from prior 2015 at ¥16,951M (Read: $160.8M) ]
5) 2017 March --------->[ 11.9% increase from prior 2016 at ¥18,969M (Read: $179.972M) ]
Expansion) 2017 June > SB release
6) 2018 March --------->[ 40% increase from 2017 at ¥26,560M (Read: $251.992M) ]
7) 2019 March --------->[ 34.7% decrease from 2018 at ¥17,356M (Read: $164.673M) ]
Expansion) 2019 July > ShB release
8) 2020 March --------->[ 12.8% increase from 2019 at ¥20,598M (Read: $195.4M) ]
9) 2021 March --------->[ Fiscal Year April 1 2020 - March 31 2021 in progress, report to release in May ]
Expansion) 2021 Fall > EndWalker Release
--------


Summary Notes
1) Failure of return of XIV on release. Record Extraordinary losses on nearly all fronts. Negative income on net, comprehensive, and reccuring incomes. No mention of XIV fallout.
2) SE is able to break from catastrophy. Report states that FF ARR is making favourable progress. Favourable sales in other titles.
3) Huge increase. SE nearly doubles comprehensive income. Report states that mmo sector (XIV & Dragon Quest X) are making favourbale progress. Strong performance in mobile games.
4) Moderate increase. Report states that mmo sector is sustatining strong performances.
5) Stable. Launch of FFXV and Rise of the Tomb Raider, and few smaller titles released onto mobile.
6) Huge increase. SE sees huge success in the mmo sector. Increase in paying subscribers and disk sales. Nier, Dragon Quest XI, and FFXII are amongst this successful year.
7) Major decrease. General low return. MMO sector continues holding strong despite net sales and operating income seeing a decrease. New titles Kingdom Heart III, Shadow of the Tomb Raider, and Just Cause 4 had poor operating income.
8) Stable. This period is right before or around global efforts to stop spread of covid. Mmo sector sees growth in monthly subscribers operating income.

In summary, SEs MMO sector and overall digital entertainment has remained relatively strong and stable since ARR.

So then, new races. How expensive are they, especially with the knowledge that SE's MMOs reign king in today ? (At the end of point 8, March 2020, SE reports that MMO sector is near ~40% of all income)
I'd like to point out Au'Ra. They were developed during a period of extreme uncertainty. If it's true that creating a new race takes time and money, then Au'Ra are a wonder. The developers or stakeholders took a risk to add a new race, working on AuRa just as ARR was released. I have reason to assume that Au'Ra did not take a full 2 years to develop without further evidence. Au'Ra were also implemented to the fullest degree that the original races are - meaning all hair and clothing articles operate as should. Points 2,3 show that SE had huge successes across all digital entertainment, including ARR. Heavensward release with Au'Ra carried on through 4,5 with overall ~37% increase in income. On point 7, during stormblood SE takes quite a hit due to a failure of expectancies on games outside of XIV.

Despite the general decrease on point 7, the fiscal year with Shadowbringers brought SE their highest return on point 8 during covid. 9 will be interesting to see.

With all this in mind, knowing the situation of Au'Ra and how much more risk there was than time or money in their creation, and the past and current of their finances, I think it's safe to say that making a new race is not financially impossible or even, dare I say it, difficult in a temporal sense. This makes me look to the decision makers, the stakeholders, shareholders, owners, projects outside of XIV, inside of XIV as a cause rather than dismissively saying "time and money".


TLDR The data is telling me "nah, i'm busy".

----------------------------------------------------------
*This is an extremely simple overview, for more in depth reports and research visit:
Square Enix's official earnings release website @ https://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng
Or navigate to square enix home page. Scroll to bottom -> Investor Relations

[SturmChurro]

Ok. No one asked for this, but I have some free time and my curiosity is once again asking for evidence or support.

Yoshida (I think) has explained before that it's not money that's the issue, but the cost in time, etc. They would need to hire and train new developers. Training new developers would take time away from current projects, resulting in more delays. There's probably some quotes from him around here somewhere that explain this much better, if anyone knows what I am trying to refer to.

At the end of their liveletter, after the EW reveal, they went into a deep dive on their development. Is also a reference. If anyone can find that.

[Amnmaat]

Yoshida (I think) has explained before that it's not money that's the issue, but the cost in time, etc. They would need to hire and train new developers. There's probably some quotes from him around here somewhere that explain this much better, if anyone knows what I am trying to refer to.

At the end of their liveletter, after the EW reveal, they went into a deep dive on their development. Is also a reference. If anyone can find that.

I would believe that if Shb didn't cut dungeons, add 2 less relic areas (Stormblood had Eureka anemos, pagos, pyros, and hydatos), barely any weapons for the new jobs (dnc and gnb), less new hair styles, and other cuts. The workload during Shadowbringer's 2 years has been less than during Stormblood and they were able to crank out female Viera and male Hrothgar.

I'm not sure how cost in terms of time can be used as a reason given what I just presented. At this point it has more to do with how they personally don't want to add them.

[VirusOnline]

Yoshida (I think) has explained before that it's not money that's the issue, but the cost in time, etc. They would need to hire and train new developers. Training new developers would take time away from current projects, resulting in more delays. There's probably some quotes from him around here somewhere that explain this much better, if anyone knows what I am trying to refer to.

At the end of their liveletter, after the EW reveal, they went into a deep dive on their development. Is also a reference. If anyone can find that.

If I had to be brutally honest, all these issues are probably more a result of feature creep - features taken to excession.

[MsQi]

So then, new races. How expensive are they, especially with the knowledge that SE's MMOs reign king in today ? (At the end of point 8, March 2020, SE reports that MMO sector is near ~40% of all income)
I'd like to point out Au'Ra. They were developed during a period of extreme uncertainty. If it's true that creating a new race takes time and money, then Au'Ra are a wonder. The developers or stakeholders took a risk to add a new race, working on AuRa just as ARR was released. I have reason to assume that Au'Ra did not take a full 2 years to develop without further evidence. Au'Ra were also implemented to the fullest degree that the original races are - meaning all hair and clothing articles operate as should. Points 2,3 show that SE had huge successes across all digital entertainment, including ARR. Heavensward release with Au'Ra carried on through 4,5 with overall ~37% increase in income. On point 7, during stormblood SE takes quite a hit due to a failure of expectancies on games outside of XIV.

Despite the general decrease on point 7, the fiscal year with Shadowbringers brought SE their highest return on point 8 during covid. 9 will be interesting to see.

With all this in mind, knowing the situation of Au'Ra and how much more risk there was than time or money in their creation, and the past and current of their finances, I think it's safe to say that making a new race is not financially impossible or even, dare I say it, difficult in a temporal sense. This makes me look to the decision makers, the stakeholders, shareholders, owners, projects outside of XIV, inside of XIV as a cause rather than dismissively saying "time and money".

To say that Au Ra were "implemented to the fullest degree that the original races are" is misleading. There are several items that have tail slots for miqo'te but not Au Ra. Many hats and helmets have been designed to accommodate Miqo'te, Elezan and Lala ears, but Au Ra Horns just poke through. I haven't seen anything that seems to be specifically designed to accommodate Au Ra features.

The point is they cut corners, and then they cut corners further with Viera and Hrothgar. To implement a new race properly and completely not only has an initial cost, but also ongoing costs.

I think they should commit to completing Viera and Hrothgar, as that is consistent with initial ARR philosophy. However I think it is best for the game to avoid any new races. There a a lot of features that could be added to existing races to give players massively more diverse options without requiring massive gear redesigns.

I'm not gonna tell people they are wrong for wanting a new race, but I'm not going to back it either.

[VirusOnline]

To say that Au Ra were "implemented to the fullest degree that the original races are" is misleading. There are several items that have tail slots for miqo'te but not Au Ra. Many hats and helmets have been designed to accommodate Miqo'te, Elezan and Lala ears, but Au Ra Horns just poke through. I haven't seen anything that seems to be specifically designed to accommodate Au Ra features.

The point is they cut corners, and then they cut corners further with Viera and Hrothgar. To implement a new race properly and completely not only has an initial cost, but also ongoing costs.

I think they should commit to completing Viera and Hrothgar, as that is consistent with initial ARR philosophy. However I think it is best for the game to avoid any new races. There a a lot of features that could be added to existing races to give players massively more diverse options without requiring massive gear redesigns.

I'm not gonna tell people they are wrong for wanting a new race, but I'm not going to back it either.

Ah, thanks for that. I very rarely play Au'Ra and don't wear hats all that much.
I agree fully. Overtime my views really have changed. I'm still very disappointed with how SE has handled the new races. The scalability of the entire character customisation and creation (especially in regards to hair, headgear, and head models) has been a downward slide and it's a pity.

The bigger question is, does anybody know if this is how SE actually runs their business and if for sure these are the issues going on?
Cause, I dont have any counter-arguments to the discussion, because I dont run a business, and Im not a dev at SE. To that effect, neither is anybody here. So while there is a chance many of you have at least a little knowledge on how things work, can you say for absolute certainty this is whats happening?

I see alot of "Shareholders need to be convinced" or "They should just hire more people" then there is "FXIV makes so much money so they should do this" and just alot of stuff.
But, it all sounds like personal opinion. And unless you actually work there at SE, its hard to really take any of this and believe it, because what YoshiP can share with us sounds abit more reasonable then just "They need more money. The money will overlap the costs"

Im more inclined to take YoshiPs word since he actually works there. Sure, it could just be corporate PR, but without actually having an insider look or knowledge on how things are running inside SE, its hard to take anybodies word here on what they think is going on.
And..despite it being a business like everything else: whos sole goal is of course to make money...I don't believe every company works the same or is run the same.
So, any talk about what Blizzard, Bethesda or Capcom does, I feel isn't the same as what Square Enix does.

Yes. Personal opinion, extrapolation of data, and observing first hand the results we are given.
No one but YoshiP and his people will know what truly goes on. But that shouldn't stop us from being allowed to have conversations about what we observe.