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  1. #1
    Player
    EONX_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    42
    Character
    Aeon Lunar
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 80

    5.3 A response to the AST "balance" changes

    The 5.3 changes to AST bring a mixture of wanted QoL as well as changes that will completely break the job in high-level progression as well as casual play. Today I'm going to go into details on the changes and why the developers need to seriously reconsider the changes they are implementing onto AST. To start off, let's talk about AST MP sustain prior to 5.3 before moving onto the 5.3 changes.

    Mana Requirements: Prior to 5.3 there was only one change needed to make AST a more fun experience for all player skill levels as well as some much needed QoL at a higher-end level. The change needed? Adding an additional perk to "Play" where it gives MP upon use. This helps mitigate the MP sustain issue with the job as well as give more incentive to players to draw and apply new cards on Cooldown. This is literally the ONLY QoL change that this job needed. They could nerf it slightly since it's OP in the hard-core scene by lowering potencies or something if they wanted but other than that, nothing else needed to be changed.

    5.3 Lightspeed change + Lowered MP cost skills: I get the idea behind this but this change was really not needed. Lightspeed was a really clutch raise skill if the stars aligned since you can get people up fast without swift, and it also won't completely destroy your MP as much as it would without it. Again though if applying cards gave you back MP then that would fix the MP issues then why are these changes here? It reduces the functionality of Lightspeed and made it strictly a DPS skill and to compensate it reduced MP cost of skills when the mana requirements have already been mitigated. These changes are not needed and only hurt AST in the grand scheme of things, by giving less utility to a unique healing ability.
    (11)
    Last edited by EONX_; 08-11-2020 at 06:05 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    EONX_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    42
    Character
    Aeon Lunar
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 80
    5.3 Sleeve Draw: This is where I really question what the developers were thinking with these changes. For those that aren't aware, pre-5.3 sleeve draw would give you 3 cards back to back to back to draw. This is an important skill in the opener, as well as for recovery (more on that later). The 5.3 changes only give you 1 card (with it being a guaranteed seal you need) without changing the cooldown. This change legitimately breaks AST in two major aspects, allow me to explain. In an AST opener your goal is to get Divination off as quickly as possible so it aligns with other raid buffs. Ideally you get two cards from Draw (use one 30s before pull, use the card after you get lightspeed, then draw and apply the second card then enter sleeve draw) but in situations where you're either chain pulling or queuing for Duty Finder stuff and people insta pull, you can use sleeve draw to compensate and get your missed card from the three it provides. To put it simply, if you chain pull/insta-pull in 5.3 with an AST, divination is AUTOMATICALLY DELAYED BY 30 SECONDS because of these changes. On top of this an AST dying for whatever reason is now unbelievably punishing (similar to Stormblood SMN). If you died prior to 5.3 as an AST, there's a good chance you can use an upcoming sleeve draw to get your seals back so you don't delay Divination. In 5.3 that's going to be LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE in most instances. If you die 30-120 seconds after your last divination, there is a very high possibility your next Divination will not have the seals it needs to be used, and this gets worse the more seals you lose on death. This is not only a completely unnecessary change, but it completely breaks the job for both opener-related circumstances as well as recovery. It's a nerf, but you could've found a way to nerf the job without breaking it.

    Please developers, reconsider these changes. AST ONLY needed receiving MP on applying cards, it did not need any of the other changes you implemented. (apologies for the double post but I wanted to give this thread and issue the length and depth it deserves)
    (7)

  3. #3
    Player
    Ilenya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,508
    Character
    Aurora Vlondett
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    I assume the MP recovery in Lightspeed was removed so that AST didn't have too much of it. There's a fine line of balance I am guessing they are aiming for...

    Where that line is, I have no idea. I assume their healer balance line is somewhere in another country right now.
    (10)

  4. #4
    Player
    Caduagm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    157
    Character
    Vincent Highwindus
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 90
    I don't even get mad anymore, because clearly they have no clue on how to balance healers - AST is just specifically worse.
    My dreams of getting a new healer in 6.0 are pretty much unreal, since I'm sure Squere will come up again with "we'd rather balance the existing healers than add a new one" for the 3rd time in a row.
    (13)

  5. #5
    Player
    EONX_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    42
    Character
    Aeon Lunar
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilenya View Post
    I assume the MP recovery in Lightspeed was removed so that AST didn't have too much of it. There's a fine line of balance I am guessing they are aiming for...

    Where that line is, I have no idea. I assume their healer balance line is somewhere in another country right now.
    Removing the 50% lower MP cost from AST is balanced out from lowering MP costs on other skills (Helios, Aspected Helios, Benefic II, Aspected Benefic, Combust, etc). If they kept Lightspeed the same and didn't lower the MP cost of other GCDs, the MP would be roughly same between the two changes.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    Synaesthesia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    55
    Character
    Nime Nisime
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 80
    I feel conflicted because I know that personally, doing the frantic burst with sleeve draw was literally the only fun thing about the new card system and partially automating it with an auto seal is doubling down on the dumbing down, but.. I think it needed to happen for controller users, it's not that fair to have a class that's that awful to play optimally.

    They've been adjusting the system with almost every balance patch since the expansion came out though.. Too weak, too cludgy, then too fast.. One after another..

    It was not that fun or amazing to begin with and it's going to be bad now but at least it will be usable properly by everyone..
    (5)

  7. #7
    Player
    Jaelommiss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    154
    Character
    Qina Jumaloth
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 90
    Dropping Sleeve Draw to a single card was clearly supposed to make AST's opener easier and reduce the need to change targets. As you mentioned, this introduces a host of other problems.

    A far more eloquent solution would have been to introduce "smart cards" that apply to the nearest relevant party member who doesn't have a buff if the AST is not targeting an ally. Playing a melee card while targeting the boss would apply it to the nearest melee dps, then tank, then ranged dps, then self, then cohealer. Ranged cards would be the same for ranged dps, self, cohealer, melee dps, then tank. Cards would still be able to be placed on specific party members if they are targeted. This would vastly reduce controller issues during Sleeve Draw while still giving players the option to buff specific players if they want to approach the skill ceiling.

    I'd also prefer that the MP from drawing cards be moved to playing cards and using Divination. 5.3 will reward drawing cards when best practices involve playing them efficiently. We're looking at 8% x14 per six minutes for 112% of max MP. I'd change it to 4% per seal per Divination (36% per six minutes with three seals, down to 12% with one seal), 4% per Play (36% per six minutes), and 8% per Minor Arcana (40% per six minutes). Same MP restored over a six minute window, with potential MP being lost if the AST is managing seals poorly.

    Without MP cost reductions and with Sleeve Draw's vastly reduced weaving requirements Lightspeed will mostly function as a mobility skill now. AST was already the most mobile healer in the game, and the second most mobile caster behind RDM. Giving them Sextuplecast greatly diminishes the skill ceiling as it relates to prepositioning and slidecasting.

    Reducing MP costs on healing spells reduces the penalties of poor play and does nothing to incentivize good play. If MP reductions are necessary (and in light of the MP gains from cards I'm not sure that they are) then it would be best to relate them to best practices. For AST that means reducing the MP cost of Malefic and Gravity. Knocking 50-100 MP off of those would have dramatic effects for efficient healers.

    The most egregious MP reduction is Benefic II. Benefic I costs 400 MP and restores 400 Potency of HP. Benefic II now costs 700 MP and restores 700 Potency of HP. Giving the "stronger, less efficient" spell equivalent efficiency to the "weaker, more efficient" spell strengthens the case for making Benefic II a direct upgrade over Benefic I.

    The people responsible for these changes have no business working anywhere near the job development department. I'd recommend they be demoted to janitorial duties but I question whether they could be trusted to not drink the cleaning products.
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player
    Semirhage's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    1,704
    Character
    Nemene Damendar
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Whaaaaaaat. Healer changes that continue the trend toward removing all disincentive from pressing random buttons and still winning? Rewarding optimal play with effectively neutral outcomes? Keep eating your porridge, healers. The beatings will continue whether your morale improves or not.

    Squeenix learns when you stop healing, whether that means unsubbing or switching to tank/DPS.
    (11)

  9. #9
    Player
    Crushnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,345
    Character
    Jets Down
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    They revert the change, controller issues come back in full force making anyone on controller hate Ast when trying to optimise it(it is the target system's fault but they ain't changing that anytime soon), they keep the change you get the issue you outlined, somebody is getting screwed and quite frankly controller issues are more severe than misaligned Divination due to early pulls/deaths both get mitigated heavily in organised play.

    So I say deal with it, if we gotta deal with this new card system because people only wanted balance, people can deal with misaligned Divinations in pug groups.

    Chain pulling is different because you aren't going for Dps your going for mechanics, everyone is misaligned under that circumstance.

    It absolutely sucks for PC players/Keyboard and mouse players but controller issues needed to be addressed since 5.0 and they finally done something about it(not the best way possible but it is something) that it is a hill I'll gladly shout from not to revert the change to Sleeve Draw(Also be funny seeing the same skill reworked for a 3rd time in 1 expansion, really highlighting how bad healers are at times)
    (9)

  10. #10
    Player
    NozomiHoshiaki's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Posts
    7
    Character
    Nozomi Hoshiaki
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 80
    Out of curiosity, are any of you that are saying optimizing pre 5.3 AST gameplay on controller, actually playing on controller with AST? I played all of Eden's Gate tier with AST Controller and got good enough that the opener was able to be done without clipping GCDs, all it takes is practice, and for me these changes to Sleeve Draw really, really stink. I will admit that it wasn't easy to play on controller at first but it was doable, changes are justifiable but also not at all what I was hoping to see happen.
    (6)

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