"New" Bard.

[SaitoHikari]

My only takeaway so far since we haven't had the opportunity to actually play with this, is that I'm livid that repertoire proc rates are STILL 20% before level 64 for whatever godawful reason. Bard doesn't really get to do much with that low of a proc rate, and now they're about to take a hit to their DoTs which affects their damage at all levels.

I feel sorry for anyone leveling Bard now. There's a reason I don't take my Bard into roulettes that have any chance of landing me in pre-70 content anymore.

[Rika007]

I'm pleased that the Dev's are at least considering are requests and giving us some utility back, but I do hold with what seems to be the consensus, it's not enough. I won't get into the balance and numbers talk, because that honestly is just not one worth going down right now. It's very very clear that the devs believe range and mobility is a huge benefit that can't be quantified in numbers when you look at the changes to the ranged physical category. I don't agree with it but I will let that just sit and watch it play out over the expansion. And besides, numbers are something that can be very easily changed as time rolls on and the community starts to settle in on what jobs they don't want present.

What I will give feedback on though is the changes, because changes in design philosophy of a job is far harder to break, especially when community expectation is different then dev vision. Great work on Apex Arrow sound changes and increasing the range. I still would like to have it be a bit more of a guaranteed oGCD I can rely on and not an RNG timed GCD, but that's a flavor thing. Thank you for bringing back song buffs, but I'm still sensing hesitancy by the devs on putting Bard back into a more support oriented role. The song buff were the least interactive part of our 4.0 support kit and honestly was probably the least wanted support skill to have back save original Tactician. People were far more interested in getting back Foe's, refresh, palisade, or reworking Minne or Paen into much more premier abilities. Passive buffs are certainly nice, and add a little flavor but thats all it is.

Yoshi-P in the interview today said that for BRD to go back to its' Stormblood level of support, it would have to be put down to Dancers level of DPS. Again I'm going to leave alone the talk of actual DPS numbers, but I don't think the devs understand, we Bard mains who have been loving and playing this job for so long and very happy with a hybrid support and DPS identity are 100% ok with this and do not find that to be that big of a negative. Stormblood Bard is one of the gold standards the dev team has made in making an amazingly fun job, right up there with current black mage and 3.0 DRG. We loved Bard that way and want to be that way again. So my feedback to the devs is this. Thank you, may I please have some more?

[MPNZ]

It's at least somewhat not super selfish now! Overall, it's basically okay until they figure out that having a base proc chance and a dynamicly scaling proc chance with critical-hit, which would make bard and dancer way more fun to play (in general & lower levels) and reward specing it in crit and skill speed. This however is a good bandaid fix, atm, but it doesn't solve the core issues which would require larger changes and testing. Like, making SV into an resource and fixing several problems like wardens being a totally lesser esuna with a rediculous recast. And a lot of things that really need to be thought out like song supports being so unimpactful for years, or the physical ranged role in general being this huge DPS loss w/o the 1%-buff. And, even things like how a job feels to play. Erm, I really need to start putting some of my thought on paper. It's starting to give me headaches just not typing them up...

[slare609]

One of the things that need to change with bard is Apex Arrow. For example, Burst shot is 240 potency which makes Apex Arrow irrational to use until over 40 Soul
Gauge. Apex Arrow should be an OGCD ability for that reason alone. Any thoughts?

[Pour]

Apex as an OGCD would make the button at least somewhat less braindead and the idea was thrown around many times, since the first gameplay dropped. I'd like it.

What I would like to know is,

1. are the changes an outright nerf to light party bard? I mean, they clearly are for the solo bardo and I'm glad that I got a decently equipped MCH to switch to.

2. With bard/mch/dnc on an equal skill level, how good has the full party got to be, to make bard really worth picking over the others?

[Hanayumi]

It was kind of expected, soooo many folks complained about Brd not feeling like a bard anymore, "give us our support songs back", yata yata. It SE of course, ya'll know they are very keen on keeping dps low when the job has a lot of utility and support, so yeah... Guess we'll see how it fairs, personally just wanted an apex fix; sound, bit more damage, and ogcd. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[chadesiel]

I wish the song buffs also effect brd itself. Why we are deaf :< .

[Shurrikhan]

I'll take this over 5.0 brd any day.

I'd prefer my contribution to come from my actions, rather than merely whether I exist within X yalms of my allies... If that can take the form of active support, all the better, but I'd rather have active damage-dealing alone than lose potency to passive ("You exist") support.

[Rika007]

I'd prefer my contribution to come from my actions, rather than merely whether I exist within X yalms of my allies... If that can take the form of active support, all the better, but I'd rather have active damage-dealing alone than lose potency to passive ("You exist") support.

Well hopefully that will be what we can get added next. The dev team clearly either didn't agree, didn't listen, or didn't understand the type of support that Bard players were looking for, as I definitely didn't see Bard players everywhere clamoring to have the passive songs be added back on. Regardless I'd rather the dev team be taking steps like this even if it' not exactly what the players are looking for to try and meet players somewhere on their wants while keeping to their vision of the game. And seeing as the ranged DPS category right now is already near the bottom of the barrel in DPS anyway, I'd rather know I'm bringing something else then just my own damage. Especially when you look at a job like MCH, who clearly needs to be bringing near SAM and BLM levels of DPS to justify it's greedy play style. The passive buff is basically our version of Standard step now. A passive buff that we shell out by making sure we press a few damage buttons every minute.

[Shurrikhan]

On the whole, I don't know if what little rDPS we gain is going to even make up for the ~400 ppm we'll be losing, let alone act as a buff. If I had to guess, I'd suspect BRD will come in last place, led by the first quartet of SMN, DNC, RDM, and MCH, then NIN, then the higher quartet of DRG, SAM, BLM, and MNK.
So, I guess at least maybe all but one Ranged will escape the gutter, though still below melee and pure dps? That hardly seems worth cheering over...

One of the things that need to change with bard is Apex Arrow. For example, Burst shot is 240 potency which makes Apex Arrow irrational to use until over 40 Soul
Gauge. Apex Arrow should be an OGCD ability for that reason alone. Any thoughts?

Wouldn't it be just as sensible to simply have it start from 240 or 270-275 (Refulgent Arrow proc chance included) potency? Personally, I prefer it as a GCD. They need only adjust the potency to keep it intuitive. Imo, it shouldn't be better than Burst Shot until at least some 20-40 Gauge, and any early use should still be a mere waste.