5.0 Dark knight request: Delirium rework

[Duskane]

Delerium does need to change (Again)
But id also like Dark side reworked into speed instead of ease of access Storms eye

What's wrong with dark mind?

Too many physical enemies and Magic enemies being rare especially in ShB dungeons

Best fix would be 10% Physical and 20% magical

[shao32]

I am more than sure that they will not change any tank in this expansion, since they are happy with current balance. Warrior may get one small change eventually but thats it.
Devs have tanks in perfect spot right now, there is little to no balance problems between them.
Balance may not be fun, but do you think they care? As a corporation, they achived their goal.

and still we have this



if delirium is consider boring at best and a determining point to stop playing the job at worse like in my case then they complety fail.

[Tranquilmelody7]

I am more than sure that they will not change any tank in this expansion, since they are happy with current balance. Warrior may get one small change eventually but thats it.
Devs have tanks in perfect spot right now, there is little to no balance problems between them.
Balance may not be fun, but do you think they care? As a corporation, they achived their goal.

First off, Paladins are significantly superior to the other 3 tanks.

Their utility far surpasses those of the other 3, they have the second highest DPS, and they have the best invulnerability skill.

Secondly, Yoshi P stated if he delivers something to the players that isn't fun, he has failed.

The current iteration of Delirium, and Living Dead(Worst CD in the entire game IMO) are not fun.

[Divinewindx]

Bring back the haste, bring back their sustain in dungeon AOE!

[EpicOverlord85]

Bring back the haste, bring back their sustain in dungeon AOE!

I really do miss blood weapons haste buff, it was nice going a little faster every so often. I also miss popping Blood Price (I also just flat out miss that skill) during a big pull and DA+Abyssal Draining everything to death. It was always so satisfying watching my HP and MP bars bounce up and down so dramatically while knowing full well I had the situation under control.

[TouchandFeel]

I also miss popping Blood Price (I also just flat out miss that skill) during a big pull and DA+Abyssal Draining everything to death. It was always so satisfying watching my HP and MP bars bounce up and down so dramatically while knowing full well I had the situation under control.

While potentially fun, being able to have that level of self-sustain while also being able to also use TBN is incredibly unbalanced. That would be like if WAR could use both Raw Intuition and Nascent Flash at the same time, which would be ridiculous, except TBN+AD spam would probably be even better.

Also keep in mind the constant complaints of previous versions of DRK that Unleash was "basically worthless" because Abyssal Drain was so much better than it. Separating Abyssal Drain from Unleashed and moving it from a spammable GCD to a recast-gated OGCD was meant to address that issue and to strengthen each ability's individual identity by giving them very different niches in the DRK kit.

Sure it may seem like a bit of a loss in game-play to players, but it is quite obvious and pretty reasonable why they made the change. They were backed into a damned if you do, damned if you don't Catch 22. Keep it the same and players will complain that SE is being lazy and not addressing their concerns.. Change it and players will complain that they "lost" what they used to have or that the changes weren't the specific ones that they wanted or thought of. Funny how that happens isn't it.

Now is Abyssal Drain's current iteration a bit underwhelming? Arguably yes, and it is something I would love SE to take a look at and address, since IMO it's heal feels super weak when outside of very large packs and it's damage is a tad ho-hum.
I would prefer if they just nix Salted Earth and roll a DoT into Abyssal Drain along with a corresponding HoT that doesn't scale with the # of enemies to provide a better base layer of self-sustain for the ability to make it better in single-target or fewer target situations.
The stronger self-heal from Soul Eater to compensate for the weak single-target sustain of AD is just too spread out in too little increments to make much of any impact to what the healers are going to do, whereas a more concentrated burst of self-healing will.

As for Bloodprice, I kind of feel that maybe they should add a scaled down version of Bloodprice's effect to Shadow Wall as a somewhat correlative effect to the additional damage that Vengeance does on being hit.

[Mailliw]

Agreed, it needs a rework. Best solution I’ve come up with is for it to grant you 5 “Stacks” of something like Dark Arts. Each stack makes combo actions free kind of like Perfect Balance for Monk while increasing weaponskill potency by 25-30%. So, you would save 100 gauge, use Delirium + Blood Weapon, Bloodspiller x2, Soul Eater, Bloodspiller, Soul Eater. While you have those stacks, MP cost is nullified for everything. So you’re weaving Edge of Shadow the entire time and get a free Blackest Night. The stacks I mentioned aren’t completely needed but this is a change I want for Warrior’s Inner Release as well, instead of a time limit you have to squeeze all your GCDs into you just have stacks that you need to spend, while you have those stacks gauge cost is nullified but in Dark Knight’s situation would nullify MP cost instead. The stacks expire after 12 seconds. 12 seconds because it gives you wiggle room to do mechanics and weave in case you clip due to latency or other issues.

This isn’t a perfect idea, as I’m sure more experienced DRK players could critique it and make it better. For myself, this will give DRK back it’s “fast” play style everyone was use to and give it a more unique Delirium.

[DRKoftheAzure]

The fact that so many "Fix Dark Knight threads" exist yet have not even gotten 1 reply from the devs or even representative(at least for the english forums) means that Square-Enix is very low on manpower because of FF7 Remake, and it shows... at least we have Gunbreaker which is as close as we are going to get for going back to Heavensward Dark Knight...

[EpicOverlord85]

While potentially fun, being able to have that level of self-sustain while also being able to also use TBN is incredibly unbalanced. That would be like if WAR could use both Raw Intuition and Nascent Flash at the same time, which would be ridiculous, except TBN+AD spam would probably be even better.

Also keep in mind the constant complaints of previous versions of DRK that Unleash was "basically worthless" because Abyssal Drain was so much better than it. Separating Abyssal Drain from Unleashed and moving it from a spammable GCD to a recast-gated OGCD was meant to address that issue and to strengthen each ability's individual identity by giving them very different niches in the DRK kit.

Sure it may seem like a bit of a loss in game-play to players, but it is quite obvious and pretty reasonable why they made the change. They were backed into a damned if you do, damned if you don't Catch 22. Keep it the same and players will complain that SE is being lazy and not addressing their concerns.. Change it and players will complain that they "lost" what they used to have or that the changes weren't the specific ones that they wanted or thought of. Funny how that happens isn't it.

Now is Abyssal Drain's current iteration a bit underwhelming? Arguably yes, and it is something I would love SE to take a look at and address, since IMO it's heal feels super weak when outside of very large packs and it's damage is a tad ho-hum.
I would prefer if they just nix Salted Earth and roll a DoT into Abyssal Drain along with a corresponding HoT that doesn't scale with the # of enemies to provide a better base layer of self-sustain for the ability to make it better in single-target or fewer target situations.
The stronger self-heal from Soul Eater to compensate for the weak single-target sustain of AD is just too spread out in too little increments to make much of any impact to what the healers are going to do, whereas a more concentrated burst of self-healing will.

As for Bloodprice, I kind of feel that maybe they should add a scaled down version of Bloodprice's effect to Shadow Wall as a somewhat correlative effect to the additional damage that Vengeance does on being hit.

It’d be unbalanced for trash pulls in dungeons though which is where I think we be all to go nuts with our abilities.

Abyssal drain no longer really has a niche though. It’s damage is meh and it’s healing is meh and it’s locked behind a long cooldown. They didn’t fix the issue, just watered one of the skills down and time gated it.

There are ways to change things for the better, this ain’t it chief.

Abyssal Drain and Salted Earth are shadows of their former selves and the nerfs give me the impression we will be losing them entirely next expansion.

That could be an interesting idea for BP.

[Nedkel]

First off, Paladins are significantly superior to the other 3 tanks.

Their utility far surpasses those of the other 3, they have the second highest DPS, and they have the best invulnerability skill.

Secondly, Yoshi P stated if he delivers something to the players that isn't fun, he has failed.

The current iteration of Delirium, and Living Dead(Worst CD in the entire game IMO) are not fun.

No, its not "sifnificantly superior" whatever that means.

Utility is situational, protect and intervention cost you Gauge that is used for sheltron, which of generation is not as good to let you use it all the time, both abilities are almost completely useless or pointless outside raids where PLD is OT.
Clemency cost you a ton of dps and its just a waste of space, passage of arms is not any better than heart of light or dark missionary, you could only use it in specific boss phases once a run, those two you could use any time you want.
Divine veil is a weaker equivalent of shake it off, you need to cast clemency if you want to make sure you will proc it.
Paladin as a OT does bring a lot, but so does DRK with his one and only TBN which he could use every 15 seconds.
Utility that PLD brings to the party barely ever has any impact on the overall team performance, because he cannot spam it and it wont bring a lot on certain situations.
I agree on hollowed ground, it is where paladin should get credit for, but then again it does come with gimmick of 7 minute long cooldown.

Saying PLD is superior because of utility is ridiculous exageration, no he is not, he is lacking on sustain department and it does hurt him. Warrior could heal himself and his friend to ful during nascent flash, DRK could spam TBN allowing healer to deal damage and this does affect their performance a lot more than any utility pld could offer.

PLD having 1-2% damage higher is on the edge of measurement error.
In dungeons he does bring a little more damage, but he is also slower due to the lack of reliable sustain. Ask any healer who they like to heal more, they will tell you warrior and DRK are easiest to heal.