Please Square do not turn Lyna into Lyse 2.0

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I'm not going to lie, Fordola was well written. She was a good character, but she was not a good person and I frankly hate her as a person. She's the poster child of broken dreams and 'I gave up'. And she only sits down and shuts up when she touches your 'mind' with the echo and realises you've gone through x100 more crap than she has and didn't end up selling out as she did. But yeah, I love the fact I'm repulsed by Fordola. She's so god damn dislikeable. The fact she wasn't straight up killed and was given some form of redemption arc bothers me so much.

I really hope in Shadow Bringers we can stop with the 'Oh, you must be redeemed' bull.



I mean, think about it. She's the only Scion that isn't combat trained. The ONLY one. All of the rest of them can fight. All of them barring Tataru, and even she is more likeable and actually tried to fight not to be dead weight! Minfillia doesn't even try, she's just dead weight. To the point that Alphy, a 16 year old lad can fill her boots and more - thus he was suggested to take over. And he could fight!

So we have a pencil pusher, who's literally telling the strongest and smartest people in the realm what to do - and even then she hardly does that! And she does a terrible job at it!

And they all still tell us what to do and where to go. Tatura is no better... what? She gets a pass cause she ran into a fight and screamed for help instead of knowing her place? PFFFT. I'm not having it. Again... I feel like people are just hating to hate... literally all of the NPCs are gulity yet Min gets all the hate? I don't understand people. Them knowing how to fight is no excuse when they still tell me what to do... all of them are worthless to me... nothing gets done unless I the WOL does it. Which to me means all of them are braindead.

[Gwenorai]

That's the point of Lyse. People who think others aren't inherently bad because they did bad things in a messed up situation. Remember, prison is supposed to be rehabilitation. When given the choice and talking with Raubahn, who wanted to kill Fordola and you say you'd spare her, he comments that your justice is a merciful one.

Aye, it just bothers me so much. Honestly, why ask for my input game if you're just going to ignore it. I just hate redemption arcs when the person is beyond redemption in my eyes. But damn her character is well done.

And they all still tell us what to do and where to go. Tatura is no better... what? She gets a pass cause she ran into a fight and screamed for help instead of knowing her place? PFFFT. I'm not having it. Again... I feel like people are just hating to hate... literally all of the NPCs are gulity yet Min gets all the hate? I don't understand people. Them knowing how to fight is no excuse when they still tell me what to do... all of them are worthless to me... nothing gets done unless I the WOL does it. Which to me means all of them are braindead.

Oh don't worry, I hate most of the NPCs who can't do crap all without WoL holding their hands. Do you like Minfillia? Good for you. I'd rather have a paperweight in my party. It'd be more useful to me and irritate me less - in my opinion~ As long as the 'little one' doesn't;-
a) follow me around as if I'm her parent and she has undying love.
b) developing a crush on my character
c) making me report to 'insert location through bluetooth device every other quest'

- I'm all good.

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Aye, it just bothers me so much. Honestly, why ask for my input game if you're just going to ignore it. I just hate redemption arcs when the person is beyond redemption in my eyes. But damn her character is well done.



Oh don't worry, I hate most of the NPCs who can't do crap all without WoL holding their hands. Do you like Minfillia? Good for you. I'd rather have a paperweight in my party. It'd be more useful to me and irritate me less - in my opinion~

It's not about me liking her or not.. I just find the hate stupid. Cause literally all of the NPCs are just as bad. There's some good ones but all the complaining about Min can be explained... like the waking sands one.... that's actually a plot point they address in the story. Everything else everyone else is gulity of, so singling out one character when all of them are pretty much the same is crazy to me... and no.. I'm NEVER letting this go. Yes.. that's the hill I'm dying on apparently.

I just hate injustice.

[Gwenorai]

It's not about me liking her or not.. I just find the hate stupid. Cause literally all of the NPCs are just as bad. There's some good ones but all the complaining about Min can be explained... like the waking sands one.... that's actually a plot point they address in the story. Everything else everyone else is gulity of, so singling out one character when all of them are pretty much the same is crazy to me... and no.. I'm NEVER lettign this go. Yes.. that's the hill I'm dying on apparently.

It's okay, you can die on that hill if you want to. I'll have minfillia arrange for some flowers to be sent.

Anyway - probably because she's a main NPC and she does it more than most. I don't know what you want me to say. 'I dislike this person more than the rest because she's the only one during the dreadful story of ARR that has not yet been pushed back into my subconcious after therapy?' She's simply more memorable.

[JunseiKei]

Aye, it just bothers me so much. Honestly, why ask for my input game if you're just going to ignore it. I just hate redemption arcs when the person is beyond redemption in my eyes. But damn her character is well done.

It'd honestly bother me more if my fellows peers within the story didn't ask me at all what I thought about anything. I can forgive / suspend choice for the context of the game (IE: I can look past the linear hallways in FFs because it keeps you on the path of the story), but been little more than a silent hero (I personally hate Link) is something that irks me.

It's not about me liking her or not.. I just find the hate stupid. Cause literally all of the NPCs are just as bad. There's some good ones but all the complaining about Min can be explained... like the waking sands one.... that's actually a plot point they address in the story. Everything else everyone else is gulity of, so singling out one character when all of them are pretty much the same is crazy to me... and no.. I'm NEVER letting this go. Yes.. that's the hill I'm dying on apparently.

I just hate injustice.

Yes, I'll die on that hill with you. It's almost like they are NPCs meant to support a player character.

[Insertcoins]

It's okay, you can die on that hill if you want to. I'll have minfillia arrange for some flowers to be sent.

Anyway - probably because she's a main NPC and she does it more than most. I don't know what you want me to say. 'I dislike this person more than the rest because she's the only one during the dreadful story of ARR that has not yet been pushed back into my subconcious after therapy?' She's simply more memorable.

I have more issue with everyone else being kidnapped since they can fight... Least Minfillia has an excuse... everyone else gets caught, kidnapped, taken etc etc all the time. Yet they can fight.. in my eyes it makes everyone else more useless.... like how you gonna get caught and you fight? But I guess that's me.

[Edax]

Yes, because under imperial law, murder of people not co-operating isn't a crime. Or starving people. Things you and I would certainly call crimes. You're purposely being contrary and looking at things from a one dimensional view.

Your the one that doesn't seem to understand how justice works. Ex post facto exists in the modern world because it protects people who did not commit any crimes under the current laws by not letting new laws retroactively punish people's actions in the past. If Ala Mhigo was run by Ala Mhigans, then very likely Fordola would likely have not committed any Ala Mhigan crimes. That is the reality of the situation. The Ala Mhigans committed murder during their riot against her family which would certainly be called crimes but they were never punished by either Imperial or Ala Mhigan laws. This story isn't finished and your looking at this as a one-dimensional "she killed people, therefore she deserves punishment" kind of judgement which is not how justice works. They all have blood on their hands and only one person is being punished for it.

She's also never been a leader before - she doesn't know what to do, but that doesn't dissuade her. I doubt you'd know how to suddenly lead an entire country with no government already in place.

If I was ever offered the leadership of an entire country at war because of who my family was, I would very sensibly turn them down. I would not selfishly take power. So I would most certainly know how to lead an entire country better then Lyse because I reject nepotism.

[Scintilla]

My personal issue with Lyse's character is her childishness. I appreciate that she was supposed to be the shielded young person (first guided and protected by Yda, then by Papalymo) being thrust into the role of a leader and having to bear the responsibilities which come with it, but in my own opinion, it was overdone.
Perhaps it was the combination of the voice acting and the writing that did it for me, but she always seemed to be complaining about something or other. She seemed over emotional; letting her own emotions and desires cloud her judgement and, although she was being progressively less led throughout, she was still heavily guided by Raubahn and advised by Hien. Zenos' defeat sums it up best: The WoL risks their life defeating both Zenos and Shinryu (a feat considered almost impossible, even more so given that they had lost to Zenos alone twice previously) and the first thing Lyse does is sulk about him taking his own life preventing her reproaching him more! It is clear that Alphinaud is also somewhat disappointed with the outcome, but he keeps it to himself and refrains from saying anything. In contrast, Lyse openly complains about how the outcome wasn't perfect and doesn't stop until Hien and Raubahn remind her that it is still a significant win for the resistance.

I don’t think Lyse’s main role of import was to be a battle strategist. That was 100% Rauban and is acknowledged in-game. What she is shown to be good at is rallying people, creating alliances, and inspiring support. Also punching things but I mean a lot of characters in FFXIV can punch things. Lyse is kind of interesting to me because she works best in a diplomatic function.

Although in a few cases she did show some aptitude (the most memorable example being her beginning the discussions around Ala Mhigo's future, in which even Alphinaud applauded her speech), there were also numerous cases in which she handled such matters very poorly. When large groups of protesters appear calling for Fordola's execution, Lyse has no handle on the situation whatsoever, with her sole response is simply: 'But then we would be no better than them'. Ultimately, it is Raubahn who is able to disperse the crowd with another of his speeches, not Lyse.

[Daralii]

I have more issue with everyone else being kidnapped since they can fight... Least Minfillia has an excuse... everyone else gets caught, kidnapped, taken etc etc all the time. Yet they can fight.. in my eyes it makes everyone else more useless.... like how you gonna get caught and you fight? But I guess that's me.

Whether or not they can fight is pretty irrelevant anyway, because the inherent power of the WoL's Echo is basically unmatched by anyone that's not an Ascian. I doubt Moenbryda or Ysayle or whoever would have been able to fight off Livia's raid or Nabriales.

I actually wonder what the response would have been if Minfilia's work had been on-camera: cutscenes dedicated entirely to her reading and responding to diplomatic messages, assigning tasks to Arenvald and the Boulder brothers, etc.

[Edax]

I actually wonder what the response would have been if Minfilia's work had been on-camera: cutscenes dedicated entirely to her reading and responding to diplomatic messages, assigning tasks to Arenvald and the Boulder brothers, etc.

The response would have been more favorable. It always helps to add character development using good writing. She was poorly handled by the devs which is why the players developed negative opinions about her. This was clearly not intentional by the devs.