I liked Eureka

[Alucard135]

getting rewarded for doing nothing is awful design.

But why are you doing nothing in the train? You help by killing the mobs that spawn the NM with the train. And if the mobs are a lot higher in level than you, you can just grab a group of 8 and go prep an NM that is around your level or less by killing 30 of the mobs that spawn it (the spawn time is random but very quick in Anemos and Pyros, unlike Pagos). That's how it was designed to spawn NMs (according to the theories lol). So in a way you made your own little train that YOU control its direction and timing. You don't have to be tied to the huge NM train if you're not doing anything in it. And if you still can't kill mobs around your level in a group of 8 and spawn NMs....then I don't know what to say here lol. The difficulty of the mobs and their mechanics there is even less than alphascape normal mode. So that should be considered a content that can be taken by casuals (a group of 8 managed to solo Penny).

On release day, since everyone is around the same level, almost everyone contributes in spawning NMs. Once the level gap grows, that's where you tend to see the AFKers in the train. Now I'm not gonna hate on the train cuz a lot of people AFK in it. It's not my business how they wanna play the content. No matter how interesting and fun a content is, if people find a way to do it without effort, they will do it like that (This is why you'll find mentors in mentor roulette drop out from EX trials as soon as they enter just cuz they don't wanna bother teaching sprouts about the content. They just want a quick way to get the 2000 roulettes).

[Alexandre_Noireau]

The fun part is. SE is gonna look at this thread and then talk about "divided opinions on content".

[XiXiQ]

you can just grab a group of 8

This is the real problem. You can't "just grab a group of 8". I wasted hours upon hours trying to do this before I gave up.

[Reynhart]

This is the real problem. You can't "just grab a group of 8". I wasted hours upon hours trying to do this before I gave up.

That's the sad part. In every instance, you have enough people to make several full parties, but everytime you suggest something like that, people replies that it's better to stay in the train, even when their low level makes them gains almost nothing in it. Sheep mentality at its best.

And the problem is that it's not because of Eureka by itself but only because it's a large scale content. The more people you have, the less implication and coordination you can require from each people separately. At least, Eureka makes it so that others not helping doesn't prevent you from gaining something, as opposed to an AFK player in a raid or trial that will roll over you at the end.

[LaylaTsarra]

This is the real problem. You can't "just grab a group of 8". I wasted hours upon hours trying to do this before I gave up.

And you need a group of 8 for what? There are plenty of anuby, Dragon and Forge groups in Pagos although they will fill up but they open up often enough and they are for mostly 34/35 level. There are many NM prep groups you can join given so many prefer just to AFK. Were you trying to do logs? If so, logs are best done and more easily done in Anemos. Not sure what type of group you were trying to join.

Edit: If you're talking Anemos I've rarely had problems trying to get a train group.

[TalithaSolarien]

The problem with Anemos is get the so much vaunted challenge logs fulfilled if you are not already level 20. Trying a group that is around your level (and your co-players most not overlevel you) is virtually impossible. And doing those alone in a full instance is slow and painful. I actually dread going into Pagos ...

[LaylaTsarra]

The problem with Anemos is get the so much vaunted challenge logs fulfilled if you are not already level 20. Trying a group that is around your level (and your co-players most not overlevel you) is virtually impossible. And doing those alone in a full instance is slow and painful. I actually dread going into Pagos ...

I would recommend not going to Pagos until you're at least 23. A full challenge log done in Anemos at level 20 will give you a full 3 levels. It's what I've done with my alts before entering. You need to be there at 25 for your kettle and light gathering. Be happy to offer you suggestions when you're ready to go.

[Arkdra]

That's the sad part. In every instance, you have enough people to make several full parties, but everytime you suggest something like that, people replies that it's better to stay in the train, even when their low level makes them gains almost nothing in it. Sheep mentality at its best.

They don't gain almost nothing from it though. The experience scales with your level and doing a level 50 nm is essentially the same experience as doing a level 36.
Also, that you can't find 7 other people to go hellgrind like it's 1998 again should be pretty telling about how people feel towards that kind of thing!

[Reynhart]

They don't gain almost nothing from it though. The experience scales with your level and doing a level 50 nm is essentially the same experience as doing a level 36.

Wrong, doing a level 50 NM at level 36 will give you far less than a lvl36 NM and far less than what the level 50 would give you at 49.

[Hestzhyen]

Assumptions

I went as WHM, figuring that I could help raise and heal folks since I wouldn't be doing much on a DPS front. Made sure to tag the boss with Aero (when I could see it), and did my best to avoid dying while raising people. That was significantly hindered by the tech limitations of boss and party members popping in and out of visibility (which has since been fixed, too little too late) and idiots dragging random mobs to where I was standing out of the way in the back (which can never be fixed). The sad thing is this chaos of dying to things I couldn't see and trying to raise people I was standing next to but couldn't target was the most efficient way of getting EXP and loot. I got to level 5 in about an hour's time, after which I called it quits. I can see why they wanted to fix the train in Pagos but doubling down on the NO FUN ALLOWED aspects was what finally killed any goodwill I had to the whole concept. SE has no idea what "fun" is for a lot of people if they think Eureka is good content.