We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[Lorgana]

It's those damned pro raiding Russians

[Miste]

Have a catch up patch where there are more i370 options and all of a sudden you have more ways to make BETTER BiS.

Even if there is more i370 options doesn't mean you will get BiS from them, that is what I was pointing out? They might not have the right substats and then you are still stuck at square one. So you missed the point in what I was saying.

This whole fiasco could've been settled with "I don't agree" instead of paragraphs.
Only that you aren't adding anything besides arguing about a single piece of my sectioned OP. And since you seem to think everything is okay, you could've even made a simple "I think the raid scene is fine" back on the first few pages and go.

So in other words "don't question my ideas or posts."

You probably shouldn't post on a public forum if you cannot handle someone disagreeing and pointing out faults in your point of view. It is typical discussion forum stuff.

I am not going to just say "I don't agree." and not explain why I don't agree. Just like in your OP you didn't say "I don't like 'all of this' about the game" and not explain why. You seem to think you can write all of your disagreements about something, but I for some reason cannot.

The moment you started talking to me with "As a raider myself" I took that as you already making the judgement that I'm not a raider so I don't know what I'm talking about. And you said it at least twice to clarify that you're a raider.

Doesn't matter how many times I said it, I was replying to what you said in your OP. If you blanket statement a group of players you might get people from that group of players responding to you?

Shall we go back to it so I can explain?

Raiders and raids are restricting the game and causing all gear progression to go stale.

The gear progression is extra bad in FFXIV and I believe the existence of raids and raiders are indirectly the root of the problem

It means we end up with rewards that aren't good enough to give incentives for casual players with marginally weaker gear to actually play it to get it and rewards that are absolutely dead on arrival to raiders. Raiders have no point in playing anything after a raid besides Ultimate which is stopping.

Raiders, don't you see how raids restrict the entire content formula?

You specifically asked raiders a question, you made claims about what raiders do or don't do in-game.

So I was like "Hey! I am a raider. These things are incorrect."

Then... you suddenly have some sort of problem about me saying I raid. Sorry, I just don't even know what to do about your issue with this. It was relevant to the discussion because you mentioned "raiders" in your OP multiple times and even directly asked raiders a question.

I don't know Miste, I'd be lying if I said I wasn't confused as to a reason why your post even appeared at such a time. 51 pages after my OP was posted while you have been here for dozens of pages already. It looked like a sudden lash-out.

I don't think it is fair to say "you shouldn't respond to my OP because you are 50 pages late." Why does it matter how many pages there are to a thread before someone responds to the OP?

This mentality is confusing to me. The only thing I can suggest is that if you would prefer not to have anymore responses to your OP you could delete it? If not then you might get replies, so you might as well accept that?

Yeah, I posted in here a bit, but I hadn't read your OP yet. I choose to respond to what some other people were saying first because I happen to come across it.

When I choose to or have time to read, that is when I will read. When I choose to respond or have time to respond is when I will respond. It is not a "suddden lash out" just because I didn't reply to your OP within the first few pages.

Ummmmm you quite randomly(in my eyes) made a really long post in defense of.. yourself(?) clearly because you were offended by my post. I merely responded in defense to you being very defensive at first. You're the one who made the post directed to me after all. And judging by the bold letters, the "do you even play this game?" and the 10 question marks at the bottom, observation tells me you were unsettled by my post, a single section I might add, as I don't normally see you post on the forum in the way you just did there. So pardon me for not understanding what even happened.

I did not make a long post in defense of myself. I made a long post pointing out the holes in your opinions and ideas that raids and raiders are basically ruining the game and your list of stuff that is "because raids" when it just isn't.

I was not offended by your post, I was confused, hence the amount of question marks throughout the entire thing. If you haven't seen me post a long reply like this in disagreement and explaining why I am disagreeing then you have not seen many of my posts.

It was not a defensive post, it was a "how did you come to these conclusions? because it makes no sense to me" post.

I did ask if you were playing this game, because some of the things you claimed are completely out of touch with how the game actually is. It is not my fault that you are posting things that make you seem out of touch with the game.

I mean you kinda claimed we can't have materia slots in our gear because of raids somehow, so excuse me for being really really confused, since I play this game and meld my gear with materia every time I get a new piece of gear.

Not to mention the "We can't have tome gear worth working for because of raids" when everyone I know who plays finds it worth it to get tome gear even for raiding. If you had said "I" and not tried to blame raids for it (since it makes no sense to) we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Sorry, but if even raiders put work in to get tome gear then it is not the raid or raider's fault you feel it isn't worth working for. I mean you also talk about wanting BiS when some of the tome pieces ARE BiS...why are they not worth working for because of raids somehow??

Yeah, still confused on this whole "raids" and "raiders" are causing tome gear to be not worth working for. It might not be worth working for for you as you claim, but the disconnect occurs where you are blaming raids and raiders for it not being worth it for you.

Okay, raider to raider then. I don't like that the only content for me to do to get gear that's ilvl cap is a raid or a tome. Because I, as a raider, won't feel like doing the raid at all if the gear from it isn't to my personal liking. *I* would like to have the perfect stats I dream of and if that includes raids and random pieces from 4 different i370 sets then so be it. That would be my choice...something that this game sorely lacks.

If that is your personal opinion on it that's fine. Technically I didn't have much of an issue with you wanting choices, my issues were with you claiming things for entire subsets and also blaming raids and raiders for things with zero facts to back up why you think you can claim such a thing.

It is unlikely they will ever give you 4 different max item level sets per tier. The game lacks choices like that because SE doesn't want to give you those choices, it reduces the longevity of the content since people can get gear faster having multiple avenues; even if weekly locked 4 chances at pieces of gear is quicker than 2 chances.

Now I am not saying this because I agree with SE's stance on not giving you choices, I sympathize with your desire to have more choices, it just isn't likely to ever happen in my opinion (minus at the end of an expansion when it doesn't matter since the expansion will have leveling progress and a whole reset item level).

Would be a good idea if you edit your OP and actually put in these "I ____" statements, because in your raider section you use the term raiders and casuals to speak for all of them instead of saying "I don't have incentives." and you claim raiders have no incentives or point to run certain content or it is DoA for them, when it should just be "I don't have incentive." and "It is DoA for me."

Your entire list of "We can't have" should also be "I can't have", because some people do think this content is worth doing and not a waste of time like this implies.

So are you saying you want to purposely try to offend me? I feel so pretty and loved right now.

No, I am saying that me explaining I am a raider in order to explain my point of view as a raider shouldn't be offending you in the first place.

If you can stop reminding me that you're a raider sure, I'll stop. I never wanted to derail my thread further and am sick of the raider conversation. Also that other guy definitely spoke poorly of me.

I really don't understand why you are so stuck on this, why does it matter if I say I am a raider to explain my point of view as a raider. It is not an offensive statement to say that I currently raid.

If you are sick of raider conversations the only thing you could do is edit your OP, because you started the conversation right on page one first post.

Can we not do this anymore? This thing was like 40,000 characters.

/shrug it's not like I am forcing you to reply, feel free to ignore me if you wish to.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

But my OP for example, has almost 3x as many likes as your first post here..so if we're going by likes for being right, would that mean I'm almost 3x rightier than you?

Now you're just being deliberately obtuse. Discussions branch off, which you have whined about incessantly across several threads. Therefore, directly comparing your likes to my initial post when I'm not even replying to you but another post is simply disingenuous. I specifically worded my response to highlight people typically agree with the "same six people dogpile" due to their own responses not merely based on the like ratio. They don't necessarily "like" the post anyway. I certainly don't. Yet whenever parsers or raiders come up, the common opinions side against you and yours. In fact, in the last several parse threads, the overwhelming majority of responses were telling the OP their stance was incorrect.

I do find it ironic you complain about threads derailing yet this post does nothing except push your own thread off topic. I guess it only matters when you don't happen to like what people are discussing.

[Ilan]

Holy moly this conspiracy theory is almost on a trump level...

[KisaiTenshi]

Holy moly this conspiracy theory is almost on a trump level...

It's called a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Here's another, they won't stop derailing the thread.

[HyoMinPark]

It's called a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Here's another, they won't stop derailing the thread.

Neither will you, my friend. The irony is that, your post that sparked this entire discussion the last 2-3 pages, wasn’t on-topic with the opening post either. At least the discussion beforehand was, regardless of how hostile it eventually became (gear progression and raiders were both mentioned in the opening post). Funny, how that is.

[MoroMurasaki]

It's called a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Here's another, they won't stop derailing the thread.

I'm sorry, I didn't know discussing a part of the opening post was derailing the thread. It's not like Magic actually had a whole section on gearing and raids and - oh, oh wait, they did?

Well then I guess raiders weighing in on the OP spreading misinformation and giving awful suggestions is on topic, so not derailing anything.

Irony police, arrest this person please.

[Dualgunner]

It's called a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Here's another, they won't stop derailing the thread.

It's a self fulfilling prophecy that Putin is pushing a pro raider agenda with his Russian hackers now?

Also you pulled this train off the tracks my guy.

[347SPECTRE]

This thread has derailed so bad, the NTSB is lurking in it.

[SaitoHikari]

Here's a community tip.

The moment you accuse complete strangers on the internet of astroturfing likes over an argument of gameplay design for a paid subscription MMO, you need to get off the internet and spend some time in the real world, because it's a clear sign that you've lost your mind and your grip on reality. And don't even try to push your derailing accountability towards everyone else, you're the one who brought up 'astroturfing' in the first place. Makes one wonder why you thought of such a term and went to such lengths to insert it into this thread in the first place.

You keep inserting dumb arguments and acting like the victim when the rest of the community calls you out on it. This act doesn't work. Maybe the forum will treat you better when you find solid arguments that don't amount to accusing the forum of being a hivemind.