Warrior rotational complexity?

[Izsha]

One of the reasons they fixed WAR is the absurd damage difference related to the rng of berserk Fell Cleaves. You could go from 4k to 4.5k literally just from critting. No other non fed class had that disparity. Personally I like WAR a lot more now, it's actually fun to play in savage now and you don't wanna just wipe if you dont crit any FCs. And WAR was relatively hard to master I admit but ironically DRK was and still is the true most complex tank.

Xeno made 1 comment about critting FCs feeling bad and suddenly the forums Wars all think that Crit RNG was some crazy burden that Wars had to carry. Crit RNG during any 1 window has an utterly miniscule effect on total DPS for a 10+ minute fight. And once you start to look at multiple Zerk/IR windows (1 per minute) during that entire 10 minutes and the handful of FCs scattered throughout the fight, regular distribution takes over and the variance starts to plummet quickly to the actual crit rate average. It FEELS bad to see no pretty numbers when you just popped your potion, but the actual effect over the duration of an encounter is completely inconsequential. No greater than the crit variance of most any job, and we don't even have Crit procs to worry about. Mnk and Brd have far greater swings based on RNG crit rate than war ever did.

Drk is probably harder to play optimally than war is now, but that's because war got thrown back into dark ages of complexity. Before that, the things that made each challenging to play optimally were very different skill sets. If your personal skill set aligned with the skills needed on war, it seemed easy-ish and drk would seem daunting and vice versa. Difficulty is both subjective and based on your own strengths.

[RLofOBFL]

snip

What? I am speaking of my personal experience. My WAR in my static has numbers varying to this degree depsite playing the exact same last raid tier. He'd do between 4.1-4.4 where PLD me would consistently be mid 4k to low 4.1k. Though I guess BRD and MNK are more rng dependant.

And WAR was never more complicated than DRK, people just never understood how to play it to its max. It has a sort of hidden complexity that most non pro drk dont(even now) really understand involving lining up BS, MP, DA and proper GCDs(not hard slash) for a buff window (usually Trick) that will only really affect that last few 300~ dps. Where as WAR it was always the same, you had strict 60/120 CD timers to adhere too, the only complexity was when to Fell Cleave vs Onslaughting. Even now it's exactly the same, only simplified, every 90 seconds burst, then decide when to onslaught or Fell Cleave(except that is almost dps negligible now).

[Izsha]

What? I am speaking of my personal experience. My WAR in my static has numbers varying to this degree depsite playing the exact same last raid tier. He'd do between 4.1-4.4 where PLD me would consistently be mid 4k to low 4.1k. Though I guess BRD and MNK are more rng dependant.

And WAR was never more complicated than DRK, people just never understood how to play it to its max. It has a sort of hidden complexity that most non pro drk dont(even now) really understand involving lining up BS, MP, DA and proper GCDs(not hard slash) for a buff window (usually Trick) that will only really affect that last few 300~ dps. Where as WAR it was always the same, you had strict 60/120 CD timers to adhere too, the only complexity was when to Fell Cleave vs Onslaughting. Even now it's exactly the same, only simplified, every 90 seconds burst, then decide when to onslaught or Fell Cleave(except that is almost dps negligible now).

The performance of 1 individual in a fight can vary for so many reasons besides crit. If you do the math, crit FCs have a very small impact. Don't want to believe me? Fine. Don't want to do the math yourself? Fine. Go look at FF logs. I just brought up the top war DPS list on Alex Prime and found the 1st set of 2 Wars with the same fight time and close DPS I found and looked at their damage.

War 1:
Fight time- 10:03. DPS 1961.

War 2:
Fight time - 10:05. DPS 1923.

War 2 is 2% behind the damage of war 1. So pretty darn close. Lets see what their crit rate is like.

AA crit rate (baseline crit)
War 1: 36.6% crit rate. Made up 20.72% of total damage.
War 2: 36.3% crit rate. Made up 19.8% of total damage.

OK. Seems they have virtually identical crit rates as their most common attacks (AAs) are virtually tied in both crit rate and % of total damage. So they should have similarly matched crit rates for FCs. They have nearly the same DPS and same base crit rate, and almost the same overall DPS and fight time.

FC Crit rate
War 1: 47.8%. FCs were 20.72% of total damage
War 2: 28%. FCs were 19.8% of total damage

War 1 crit nearly half of all his FCs. High rolled the shiz outta that. War 2 got boned. He got a lower crit rate than his AAs and the way deliverance stacks work, FCs naturally have a higher crit rate than your overall crit rate. He low rolled the shiz out of this fight.

Yet they are still within 2% DPS of each other.

FC Crits DONT MATTER in the grand scheme of things. They feel bad. But the numbers don't reflect that feeling. Its a placebo. In your head. If your static warrior is all over the map its because he is not a consistent player. Not Crits. Your pld is obviously a much more consistent player maintaining uptime and other fundamentals that affect your damage far greater than the smidge of effect crit FCs have.

The numbers don't lie. This is just 1 example, but if you run the numbers you will come to the same conclusion. You can easily break down how much damage FCs contribute and then adjust an imaginary crit rate. But the bottom line is that FCs are only about 20% of your damage (back in HW). The ones that are under Zerk windows and IR windows shrinks that more. Then theres the fact that you will do 20-30 FCs depending on fight length. The statistical probability of critting nearly all or nearly none of them when you will (on oaverage) have around a 40-45% crit rate on FCs is near zero. So the amount that 20% can vary in actual scenarios is very limited. High rolling a near 50% crit rate bumped that up to 20.72%. Low rollilng droped it to 19.8%. Crits are still spread out among all your other hits and actions. So if you have a normal crit rate and happen to land them on FCs, you get a TINY boost. If you get them all on other actions you still get damage anyway. The only way you would have a dramatic swing in damage would be if you had an OVERALL crap or high crit rate over ALL actions, not FCs. And the probability of that is winning the lottery levels of unlikely. a 35% crit rate over every action in a 10 min fight low rolling to 10% or high rolling to 50+ is virtually impossible. Go flip a coin fro every action and AA in a 10 minute fight and see how many heads/tails you get. You will get close to 50/50 after all those hundreds of flips. If you get 10% you should buy a lotto ticket too cuz you just had once in a generation luck. FCs that don't crit just shift to another lower potency action, but as long as they don't disappear leaving you with an abnormal overall crit rate it wont bump your damage any significant amount.