All Greed on Alliance loot

[Vivi_Bushido]

I'm against the idea as well, but alliance raid and gear has always been released in catch up patches used for catch up gear. I assume this is so players can catch up their alt jobs considering that alliance gear is almost always outdated but the halfway point of the patch. With a new expansion to Eureka, there's the possibility they might enhance the relic gear to 360 then 365 after that. Making Alliance gear greed only gives more reason to farm it I suppose? Just a theory.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I'm against the idea as well, but alliance raid and gear has always been released in catch up patches used for catch up gear. I assume this is so players can catch up their alt jobs considering that alliance gear is almost always outdated but the halfway point of the patch. With a new expansion to Eureka, there's the possibility they might enhance the relic gear to 360 then 365 after that. Making Alliance gear greed only gives more reason to farm it I suppose? Just a theory.

The irony is they've now made it significantly harder for tanks who actually want the gear because all the raiders playing their DPS alts can roll on it for glamour. It's an incredibly shortsighted change that benefits no one except people who want gear for a job they won't play.

[Neophyte]

The irony is they've now made it significantly harder for tanks who actually want the gear because all the raiders playing their DPS alts can roll on it for glamour. It's an incredibly shortsighted change that benefits no one except people who want gear for a job they won't play.

No one? And what about the people who actually play a lot of jobs?
You know, those that don't play healer/tank/any job, just because they can need on glamour items, with their ilvl 310 weapon and no skill at all.

Let's say I could use an upgrade on healer/DRG/NIN. Instead of going NIN x times a week and hoping for NIN gear to drop and hoping to have no other NIN (or same with any other job)... I can go healer->DRG->an BiS job not needing gear at all->tank->whatever and have just to beat RNG regarding any drop I could use and then have to win against people with a weekly lockout (people should roll pretty careful).

I rather roll against people I can talk to with lockouts (so not 7 will roll on tank loot I guess) than have to deal with that rng bs to be on NIN when drg gear drops and other way round.
I can just going as most needed role, speeding up queue for me and everyone else.

And yes, it's also baffling how people defend the unfair situation that as a healer you always have to roll against someone and as a tank never. Ppl dont care why?

[MoroMurasaki]

I can just going as most needed role, speeding up queue for me and everyone else.

How is this any better than the current system, honestly?

Let's look at your NIN example. With the current system you can play NIN and maybe have to roll against another NIN, more than likely not. The only job in the current 24man that is guaranteed competition on "Need" drops every 24man would be healers though admittedly sometimes DPS are doubled up. Tanks never have this issue right now.

In the future tanks aren't guaranteed tank-drops. That NIN isn't guaranteed NIN items in a party where they're the only NIN. Those healers are going from rolling against one other person (at max) to up to 7 others.

Oh, but you get to play your main to gear an alt - yeah, because that matters. Lol.

[Neophyte]

Oh, but you get to play your main to gear an alt - yeah, because that matters. Lol.

Yes it matters to be able to play as any job I want anytime instead of being bound to a certain job.
I'm able to alternate jobs, sure, but only as long as they didnt get a drop. If I'm lucky and get DRG gear fast I'm still maybe stuck the whole next week on NIN and only NIN.
What really doesn't matter is "I want people to play as the role they want gear on just because, and I don't care that the system is unfair already with job based rolls.".

Someone said ilvl of Rabanastre is ilvl305. It matter to me that less people are inclined to use that low jobs to get an upgrade. Yay, a tank with 290 weapon and no experience, I'm so glad that he doesn't went in with his 354 DRG and made room for someone who actually can hold emnity.

As I said, I rather roll against ppl than just being screwed by game rng.
The outcome doesn't change for me, propbaly 3-6 runs a week to get my drop, with that many jobs I often greed already..
But higher ilvl and higher skill on average and being able to queue at most needed role is a good thing.

Same why ex primal greed farms are way smoother and better... instead of people wanting to replace their 310 weapon on their jobs they can't play, you actually get decent players sometimes.

With weekly lockouts and 6 drops per run, I will get my loot pretty fast now.

[MoroMurasaki]

Yes it matters to be able to play as any job I want anytime instead of being bound to a certain job.
I'm able to alternate jobs, sure, but only as long as they didnt get a drop. If I'm lucky and get DRG gear fast I'm still maybe stuck the whole next week on NIN and only NIN.
What really doesn't matter is "I want people to play as the role they want gear on just because, and I don't care that the system is unfair already with job based rolls.".

Someone said ilvl of Rabanastre is ilvl305. It matter to me that less people are inclined to use that low jobs to get an upgrade. Yay, a tank with 290 weapon and no experience, I'm so glad that he doesn't went in with his 354 DRG and made room for someone who actually can hold emnity.

As I said, I rather roll against ppl than just being screwed by game rng.
The outcome doesn't change for me, propbaly 3-6 runs a week to get my drop, with that many jobs I often greed already..
But higher ilvl and higher skill on average and being able to queue at most needed role is a good thing.

Same why ex primal greed farms are way smoother and better... instead of people wanting to replace their 310 weapon on their jobs they can't play, you actually get decent players sometimes.

With weekly lockouts and 6 drops per run, I will get my loot pretty fast now.

You must be in very good shape to perform these mental gymnastics.

Lets assume the rate at which gear drops is 6 items per run. Let's go for the healer body piece. Right now there are 7 'classes' of gear (tank/heal/caster/ranged/nin/drg/mnksam) and 6 items that can drop per set (head/chest/hands/belt/legs/feet) so this means each run I have a 1/7 chance to have that item drop. This doesn't take into account how (right now) some coffers only drop some gear, I'm erring on the side of caution.

Now that means potentially 7 runs to see that healer chest drop. Right now I have to roll against 1 other person on it so there is a 50% chance I will get the item if it does drop. That's another potential 7 runs if I lose just to see that item again.

Now lets take this in a new direction - the new all greed system. Same 6 potential drops, same 7 armor 'classes' and same 6 armor slots. Now I can be rolling against anywhere from 1 to 7 other players on the 1/7 chance the item I want actually drops.

Let's not forget this is a system that is only going to further degenerate as time goes on. The first few weeks might be okay - people running it will likely be focused on gearing specific jobs with specific items rather than greeding everything because in the short term these items are still upgrades for them... how about a month or two down the line though?

People who have been capping Mendacity every week have multiple gear sets at or above the level dropped in the new raid, these players are grabbing for desynth fodder or glam. More people who don't care what they get means more people rolling on every item. Players just reaching this content who might actually get upgrades from it are now on even footing with every other person in their group who is rolling more or less just to not miss their lockout on something. This isn't even accounting for any items that might actually be in demand for glamor or the fashion report - best of luck on those.

I have healed and dpsed for many an undergeared tank in Rabanastre - know what's worse than a squishy tank? Having to run the whole damn raid again because some DRG with no casters leveled past 30 beat me to my RDM hat.

"But there is a lockout," you guys yell, "People won't greed blindly on things!!"

Really? Are you honestly telling me you think the majority of the playerbase who is still wiping to things like Ancient Flare and the stack markers in Hashmal is informed enough to know or care about a weekly lockout on gear? I had a RDM in a Rab run I did earlier with more health than me pulling 1,800 dps with no deaths. Some people are just not as invested in this game and that's fine but let's not act like their lack of knowledge and foresight isn't going to bite a lot of people in the ass with this new system. It's elementary school math.

I've never been more thankful to have a good group of friends to play this game with - it's going to mean partying up with 7 other competent players to run Ridoranna virtually every time so that we can make sure we're fair and considerate about our loot drops. I'm sure I'm not the only one thinking this way either, I could see this gear system forcing a lot of players to party with friends, making the pug market even more deficient than we've seen in Rab.

A whole host of problems await everyone upon the release of this system, the only limit to the number of them is how much time you have to look at it and poke more holes.

Thank god you don't have to play a week straight as NIN though. I'm sure that makes it all worth it.

[Neophyte]

Thank god you don't have to play a week straight as NIN though. I'm sure that makes it all worth it.

Thanks. In the end I take the advantages for me and be fine.

At least I don't need to pretend that 'everyone' has only disadvantages... there are ppl who get disadvantaged, some have it better or equal, overall it's more fair (same rng for everyone everytime), average ilvl/skill should be higher, less ppl playing a job just for rolls, faster queues.

I'm fine and probably thousand of other players (most of those wanting to play more different jobs than they have jobs they need gear for) as well and if there are statistics proving one or the other "more fair" the result would be the system we'll be getting.
I value it a lot higher to play what I want (5 runs with 5 different jobs), than to have to choose a job based on chances for loot.

With this system the amount of tanks queuing will stay roughly the same (the amount of ppl wanting to tank), with the old one it gets less tanks week by week (assuming ppl who need tann gear queue as tank right now and stop queuing after they got it -> less tanks per week).


I mean srsly... bringing up things like desynth (you can't desynth or turn in new 24-man gear for up to 6 months) proofs that people dont think before they complain.
Rabanastre is almost half a year old and you still can't do that.
And no, it can't be 7 who roll on every item, 7nppl rolling on an item can occur once in the whole run.
When I aim for something which drops at 1st and 4th boss, at the 4th boss I will never, never, ever have 7 competitors, unless 5 pieces dropped to the ground.

And if ppl roll blindly at everything even better. Every belt and bad gear then means one less person rolling on the good stuff.

It stays, i rather ask myself 'what do I want to play' than 'what do I need to gear'.

[Jijifli]

I assume this is so players can catch up their alt jobs

I have a wonderful idea that they could have applied earlier to boost their chance of getting gear for a job. Play the job.

Seriously, the item level requirements are bare bones tiny. I had a RDM once in Rabanastre that was still in basically their full artifact 290 set, with some 300 accessories, and it let them in. They had the item level. They didn't have the HP to survive any mechanics, but they had the item level.

So is they can get in with such a low amount, why can't others? Why do I gotta roll with someone who might not even have that role leveled up, just because he didn't like what I did and wants to screw me out of the chest I ran 15 times to see?

Why do you think that random players will burn their weekly lockout on something they don't want or can't even use? That makes no sense. They will roll on what they want, just like you.

I got nasty slurs thrown at me in Rabanastre on my BRD for taking a bard piece, from a WHM who really wanted it for their level 34 bard. They didn't have MCH either, not even unlocked.

So don't tell me they don't exist. That rest of the run was terrible since only the SCH would actually heal me, the WHM ignored me outside of aoe spells.